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tmandoug1 · 10-01-2022, 11:47 AM

Interesting read for those interested in eco friendly. Clearflame may be close to an answer.

https://ethanolproducer.com/articles...next-open-road

Old-Biscuit · 10-01-2022, 12:43 PM

“Ethanol is high-octane, which means it’s hard to burn. But if you can get a diesel engine to run hotter, even a high-octane fuel like ethanol will burn in the same engine cycle.”

Bigceasar · 10-01-2022, 12:56 PM

At large scale production ethanol fuel would be a direct competitor to an even more critical resource, food. Doubtful you can grow enough crops to satisfy both due to constraints of water, crop land and weather.

Archer2 · 10-01-2022, 01:04 PM

That is a very interesting article, Mr. Biscuit. Do you have any links to more technical details?

Old-Biscuit · 10-01-2022, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Archer2

That is a very interesting article, Mr. Biscuit. Do you have any links to more technical details?

Not my article....I just quoted from it.

propchef · 10-01-2022, 05:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bigceasar

At large scale production ethanol fuel would be a direct competitor to an even more critical resource, food. Doubtful you can grow enough crops to satisfy both due to constraints of water, crop land and weather.

The corn in this equation is dent or field corn, not human food. We grow more than enough.

tmandoug1 · 10-01-2022, 05:13 PM

The real question is.....is this worth an investment?

Old-Biscuit · 10-01-2022, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by propchef

The corn in this equation is dent or field corn, not human food. We grow more than enough.

True dent corn is used. (Sweet corn is what WE eat)
But using it for increased supply of ethanol will put a dent in corn chips and starving cows

propchef · 10-02-2022, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old-Biscuit

True dent corn is used. (Sweet corn is what WE eat)
But using it for increased supply of ethanol will put a dent in corn chips and starving cows

There's always 'tater chips.

FYI, cows only eat corn because we force-feed it to them. Cows are ruminants and will be just fine without any corn and in fact, we'll have fewer e-coli outbreaks if we remove corn from their diet.

PhilAndTee · 10-02-2022, 03:52 PM

Where is all of this corn going to grow? The space is the biggest issue.
500 galloms of ethanol created per acre.
46.82 billion gallons of diesel used per year.

jrollf · 10-03-2022, 12:48 PM

Corn is really a horrible source for ethanol, it is used for ethanol in the US due to huge farming subsidies that make it profitable.

There are many better sources that take less water amd energy to grow, switchgrass is toward the top of the list.

https://engineering.mit.edu/engage/a...e-for-ethanol/

"Second-generation biofuels are made from a wider variety of nonfood sources, such as cellulose, algae and recovered waste products. Cellulosic ethanol produced from native prairie perennial switchgrass, plus agricultural forestry and municipal residues such as wood chips and paper sludge, has the greatest potential to become a viable primary transportation sector energy carrier, experts agree.

Among switchgrass’s benefits are essentially zero net emissions of greenhouse gases and improved fertility from the carbon that switchgrass replaces in the soil as it grows. In future scenarios, farmers could keep soil fertile for by rotating switchgrass with food crops."

TravelSolo · 10-03-2022, 05:41 PM

The current ethanol market is bad for the environment, adding more demand for it to satisfy the diesel market will only make it worse. Sure it helps with ICE emissions but the loss of land, greater water consumption, additional emissions from farming and processing it, transporting it, etc are supposedly exceeding the emissions reductions from the ICE that are using it.

TandW · 10-03-2022, 06:02 PM

Right off we see that the corn producers provided most of the research money.
Coming off of that, it would be difficult to believe that the injectors and pump would survive for very long running in what is essentially a solvent. Piston scuff may be a problem also.

propchef · 10-04-2022, 06:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhilAndTee

Where is all of this corn going to grow? The space is the biggest issue.
500 galloms of ethanol created per acre.
46.82 billion gallons of diesel used per year.

We already have a glut of corn. See below.

Quote:

Originally Posted by jrollf

Corn is really a horrible source for ethanol, it is used for ethanol in the US due to huge farming subsidies that make it profitable.

There are many better sources that take less water amd energy to grow, switchgrass is toward the top of the list.

https://engineering.mit.edu/engage/a...e-for-ethanol/

"Second-generation biofuels are made from a wider variety of nonfood sources, such as cellulose, algae and recovered waste products. Cellulosic ethanol produced from native prairie perennial switchgrass, plus agricultural forestry and municipal residues such as wood chips and paper sludge, has the greatest potential to become a viable primary transportation sector energy carrier, experts agree.

Among switchgrass’s benefits are essentially zero net emissions of greenhouse gases and improved fertility from the carbon that switchgrass replaces in the soil as it grows. In future scenarios, farmers could keep soil fertile for by rotating switchgrass with food crops."

^^^^^ Yup. They've been using switchgrass in Brazil for decades.