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Old 06-14-2021, 08:33 AM   #1
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My new toy hauler

Hello all,

New Adrenaline toyhauler owner. I roadrace motorcycles and the past 8 years or so I've had a 2009 Jayco Jayflight G2 23FBS trailer that my wife and I have used at the racetrack and also do 2 or 3 camping trips per year with.

When I only had one race bike to haul it wasn't too bad loading the bike and all the race gear in the back of my 1/2 ton truck. The Jayco was light enough to stay within the ratings of the truck though with the racebike and gear and tongue weight, I was approaching the rear axle weight raing.

My son has since started racing and I own a second bike for myself, so now I usually am hauling two bikes to the track. While possible, it is quite a pain to get two bikes and all the gear in the bed of the truck and when adding the tongue weight of the Jayco it put me over the rear axle (payload) rating of the truck.

So in October the wife and I started looking at Toyhaulers. We were trying to find one with a seperated garage that was still 1/2 ton towable. We ended up order a Keystone Impact Fusion 28V. Though I suspected I would be slightly over GCWR, I felt better that with the bikes in the toyhauler rather than in the bed of the truck I would no longer be over the rear axle weight limit.

Long story short, the salesperson promised stuff that we later learned were not even possible on toyhauler we ordered. Things like a ramp patio package with a gate and stairs and a tent wall for the ramp door. We also ordered the toyhauler with a generator. An Onan 4.0KW was available as option from the factory but the dealer made the decision to install it themselves so they could upgrade us to 5.5KW. When the trailer arrived at the dealership we did a pre-inpsection and had quite the list of questions and issues that needed to be addressed. We were assured the isses would be taken care of but when our pick up date arrived, May 7th, nothing was right, including the generator being missing. We ended up walking away from the deal and realizing our goal of finding a toyhauler that checked all our boxes was not going to be towable with a 1/2 ton truck.

So May11th we traded in our 2015 1500 silverado for a 2015 GMC 2500 Denali. On May 15th we purchased a Brand new 2021 Coachmen Adrenaline 34GM Toyhauler. The 34GM floorplan is so new it isn't even on the Coachmen website yet. The 2021 brochure only shows a silhouette of the floorplan with TBD on it and no specs listed.

Picked up the trailer Satruday and installed the pit bull mototrcycle trailer restraints in the garage. I will be able to fit all three race bikes now and even have room for the wife's little pit bike.
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Old 06-14-2021, 09:09 AM   #2
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Nice toyhauler but that's way too much trailer for a 2500.

I have a Winnebago 29STT rated at 13k lbs GVWR, 500 lbs less than yours.

Just weighed it with my X4 UTV in it - 12650ish. However without the toy in it the tongue weight is nearly 2000lbs. My rear axle was at 6100 lbs so that would go up as well without the side by side in it.

I sold my F250 short bed for a long bed F350 and it's barely comfortable without running my old propride hitch...
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Old 06-14-2021, 04:50 PM   #3
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Very nice.
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Old 06-14-2021, 05:35 PM   #4
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Congrats on the new rig! Let the adventure begin!

Good luck, happy trails, and God bless!
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Old 06-14-2021, 06:18 PM   #5
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Congrats on the new rig. Continue to enjoy the adventure!
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Old 06-14-2021, 06:52 PM   #6
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Welcome from a retired Sportbike Track Time Instructor. Safe travels and enjoy the new T.H.
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Old 06-15-2021, 06:13 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swavescatter View Post
Nice toyhauler but that's way too much trailer for a 2500.

I have a Winnebago 29STT rated at 13k lbs GVWR, 500 lbs less than yours.

Just weighed it with my X4 UTV in it - 12650ish. However without the toy in it the tongue weight is nearly 2000lbs. My rear axle was at 6100 lbs so that would go up as well without the side by side in it.

I sold my F250 short bed for a long bed F350 and it's barely comfortable without running my old propride hitch...
Please explain to me how this is "way too much trailer".

My rear axle rating is 6200lbs and payload of 2660. The tongue weight at 15% of GVWR of trailer would be 2000lbs, which would be absolute worse case scenario. I don't plan on being at GVWR of trailer or 15% tongue weight. I don't expect to have much weight in the bed of the truck and my wife and I do not weight anywhere near 660 lbs LOL!

Pulling it home 300 miles from the dealership through the hills and mountains of Central PA (likely the most elevation change I will see in my travels) it pulled and handled very well. Yes it was empty, but as you just stated an empty toyhauler has a higher tongue weight than when the garage is loaded with toys.

Other than personal opinion from your own experience what facts or numbers do you have to claim this is "way too much trailer" for my truck?

What exactly, do you expect I will have trouble with?
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Old 06-15-2021, 07:35 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sv Todd View Post
Please explain to me how this is "way too much trailer".

My rear axle rating is 6200lbs and payload of 2660. The tongue weight at 15% of GVWR of trailer would be 2000lbs, which would be absolute worse case scenario. I don't plan on being at GVWR of trailer or 15% tongue weight. I don't expect to have much weight in the bed of the truck and my wife and I do not weight anywhere near 660 lbs LOL!

Pulling it home 300 miles from the dealership through the hills and mountains of Central PA (likely the most elevation change I will see in my travels) it pulled and handled very well. Yes it was empty, but as you just stated an empty toyhauler has a higher tongue weight than when the garage is loaded with toys.

Other than personal opinion from your own experience what facts or numbers do you have to claim this is "way too much trailer" for my truck?

What exactly, do you expect I will have trouble with?
I made the same mistake. Struggled for a year to try to make it work but in the end upgraded my truck. I'll break it down for you with facts and subjective impressions.

Facts:
-When not hauling toys in the garage (or light toys like motorcycles), these units are notoriously tongue heavy by design (i.e. upwards of 15%).
-With fresh water tank full and garage empty, my MEASURED (weighsafe hitch and Sherline tongue weight scales) tongue weight was 1850lbs. What is your hitch receiver weight rating?
-Loaded up for camping (crap in my bed, but also heavy side by side in the rear garage that lightens the load), my rear axle weight was 6180 lbs. Your axle rating is 6300lbs, so with lighter toys in your BIGGER toyhauler I'm guessing you'll be over the limit on your hitch AND rear axle AND tire load ratings.
-1800lbs tongue weight + 60lbs for hitch + passenger weight + junk in the bed of the truck = potentially greater than your payload (which is not the major issue, axle/tire ratings are the real drivers for safety.)

Subjective:
-These trailers suck at towing compared to normal TT's. Based on toys in the garage and fresh water fill level, my tongue weight jumps all over the place. Loaded up on my most recent trip my tongue weight was just under 10% trailer weight. I struggled to moved stuff forward as far as possible so it would be stable.
-Diesel engines pull just fine, but that's not the issue. Axle/tire ratings and towing stability are key. With tongue weight shifting all over, a long bed truck really helps to prevent death wobble.
-In my short bed F250 I used a Propride hitch to band-aid this instability. That only added more pounds to my already over-loaded hitch receiver, and those suck to hitch up offroad. I knew my ratings were exceeded, but it pulled OK. Still, not legal and not safe.
-You don't "plan" to load your trailer to the max weight, but these creep up on you. Also, without full fresh water tanks, your rig will likely be very nose light (dangerous) if you have toys in the back.
-These trailers are MASSIVE, and yours is bigger than mine. 6" wider than normal trailers, and about a foot taller. With my longbed 1 ton I need to keep a firm grip on the wheel with wind out. For this reason I load the bed of my truck as much as possible to increase the weight of my tow vehicle and fight against the trailer sway.

But then again, some people don't care about proper tow vehicle sizing/safety ratings. I see guys pulling triple axle 5ers all the time with 3/4 tons trucks - it's a diesel right?!



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Old 06-15-2021, 09:39 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by swavescatter View Post
I made the same mistake. Struggled for a year to try to make it work but in the end upgraded my truck. I'll break it down for you with facts and subjective impressions.
What exactly did you struggle with? I'm still not sure what issues you think I will have.

Quote:
Facts:
-When not hauling toys in the garage (or light toys like motorcycles), these units are notoriously tongue heavy by design (i.e. upwards of 15%).
Well in the instance I'm not hauling toys my total weight is going to be considerable lower so even if it is at 15% I will likely be under 1500 lb tongue weight anyways. With no toys on Saturday I had no issue setting up the propride and getting good truck suspension numbers.

Quote:
-With fresh water tank full and garage empty, my MEASURED (weighsafe hitch and Sherline tongue weight scales) tongue weight was 1850lbs. What is your hitch receiver weight rating?
Don't see an instance where I will travel with water but nothing in the garage. We boondock only at the racetrack so I will always have at least 1000lbs in the garage. If I'm going camping without the racebikes I'm not going to be carrying water either.
Quote:
-Loaded up for camping (crap in my bed, but also heavy side by side in the rear garage that lightens the load), my rear axle weight was 6180 lbs. Your axle rating is 6300lbs, so with lighter toys in your BIGGER toyhauler I'm guessing you'll be over the limit on your hitch AND rear axle AND tire load ratings.
You labeled this the "facts" section yet you are admitting that your conclusion is "guessing" LOL!
Quote:
-1800lbs tongue weight + 60lbs for hitch + passenger weight + junk in the bed of the truck = potentially greater than your payload (which is not the major issue, axle/tire ratings are the real drivers for safety.)
potential or fact? Sounds like you are guessing again.

Quote:
Subjective:
-These trailers suck at towing compared to normal TT's. Based on toys in the garage and fresh water fill level, my tongue weight jumps all over the place. Loaded up on my most recent trip my tongue weight was just under 10% trailer weight. I struggled to moved stuff forward as far as possible so it would be stable.
That is why I invested in a propride hitch.
Quote:
-Diesel engines pull just fine, but that's not the issue. Axle/tire ratings and towing stability are key. With tongue weight shifting all over, a long bed truck really helps to prevent death wobble.
Propride
Quote:
-In my short bed F250 I used a Propride hitch to band-aid this instability.
How is a propride a band aid? Friction sway control is a band aid. Is a 5th wheel a band aid, because that's what a propride hitch does. It projects the pivot point up to the rear axle of the truck so it behaves just like a 5thj wheel. Physics is more fact than your subjective opinion.
Quote:
That only added more pounds to my already over-loaded hitch receiver, and those suck to hitch up offroad. I knew my ratings were exceeded, but it pulled OK. Still, not legal and not safe.
Again you are making a lot of assumptions to "guess" what my hitch weight is.
Quote:
-You don't "plan" to load your trailer to the max weight, but these creep up on you. Also, without full fresh water tanks, your rig will likely be very nose light (dangerous) if you have toys in the back.
Make up your mind dude...Am I going to tongue heavy or tongue light? LOL! Sounds like a lot of speculation and guessing to me. I have an accurate estimate of my cargo weight because I've been doing this for quite some time. I know how much my old trailer weighed both empty and loaded and I know exactly what my racebikes and equipment weigh. I'm not speculating like you are. I actually know exactly what came out of the old trailer and what is going in the new one.

I'm not worried if I'm a little tongue light with the propride. If you truly understood the physics of the propride hitch you would agree.
Quote:
-These trailers are MASSIVE, and yours is bigger than mine. 6" wider than normal trailers, and about a foot taller. With my longbed 1 ton I need to keep a firm grip on the wheel with wind out. For this reason I load the bed of my truck as much as possible to increase the weight of my tow vehicle and fight against the trailer sway.
Propride. Just becuase you owned on briefly doesn't mean you understand what they actually do.
Quote:
But then again, some people don't care about proper tow vehicle sizing/safety ratings. I see guys pulling triple axle 5ers all the time with 3/4 tons trucks - it's a diesel right?!

I guess we will find out soon enough. I'm loading the toyhauler up with three race bikes and a 2/3 tank of water this weekend. I'll let you know how it goes.

Oh by the way your CAT scale ticket is irrelevant to me. Your F350 curb weight is significanly higher than my 2500, which of course means your actual truck axle weights are going to start higher than mine.
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Old 06-15-2021, 11:12 AM   #10
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Good luck kiddo.
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Old 06-15-2021, 11:53 AM   #11
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Good luck kiddo.
Kiddo?
You sure do like to make assumptions don't you? LOL!
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Old 06-21-2021, 06:41 AM   #12
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Loaded up the rig and headed to the racetrack this weekend. Trailer pulled great with zero issues or drama. This was with 3 bikes and all the typcial race gear I bring to the track, 2/3 full tank of fresh water, 10 gallons of fuel in fuel station, and all the stuff the wife had in the old trailer plus some.

Even with heavy cross winds coming off Lake Erie it was easy one handed driving the whole way. Yes I could feel the wind pushing the whole rig but it pushed the truck and trailer as one single unit. Zero sway...

I ran the truck across the scales at the first Love's truck stop in Ohio...
800 lbs under RAWR and 340lbs under GCWR. Added another 126 lbs when I filled up the fuel station.

Front wheel well measured with WD bars fully tensioned was within 1/4" of truck without trailer measurement. Rear wheel well showed about 2-1/4" sag. Truck and trailer both looked level, with about 1/2" difference in frame measurement from front to back of trailer with the front just slightly lower than the rear.

Love the Propride 3P. Was easy to use and was able to hitch up first try everytime with no issues.

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Old 06-22-2021, 04:11 PM   #13
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Congrats on your new rig

May you have many miles of smiles.
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Old 06-23-2021, 11:42 PM   #14
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Congrats on your new rig! Have fun and enjoy the journey.
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