California plans to ban small IC engines by Jan 2024

[CamJam1]

Originally Posted by MRUSA14

If so, start buying up used generators now, for sale later at much higher prices. Don't you love the way the government cares for its people's needs?

The reasons for it are scientifically valid, but politically I think this is really a dumb move. Horrible timing too with much more important matters to deal with right now.

That said, people like to kick California to the curb, forgetting about problems in other states. Texas power grid is a good example. I drove through Idaho, Nebraska, Wyoming and Kansas recently and rural poverty is just as prevalent in some areas there as it is in the cities, just more spread out. A lot of those little towns have been dying for years.

[dbircky]

I keep hearing that going all electric will also cause savings in maintenance. However, there’s no oil changes in a two stroke and I fail to see how having an electric yard machine will stop blades from going dull, tines wearing out, tires getting punctured. What I have noticed is the lithium batteries not lasting more than a couple of years on the cordless ryobi tools I have. Additionally the cordless blower has less than half the speed of the admittedly larger backpack 2 stroke one. I wonder how heavy a comparable battery powered one would be? Only have 4 acres to mow, currently using a 54” mower, I haven’t seen an electric one in that size.

I’m thinking that a yard service would be using their equipment most hours of the day with the only downtime during moves from job sites. Perhaps a solar rapid charger could fill all those tools while driving 15 minutes to the next job?

[radar]

Originally Posted by dbircky

I keep hearing that going all electric will also cause savings in maintenance. However, there’s no oil changes in a two stroke and I fail to see how having an electric yard machine will stop blades from going dull, tines wearing out, tires getting punctured. What I have noticed is the lithium batteries not lasting more than a couple of years on the cordless ryobi tools I have. Additionally the cordless blower has less than half the speed of the admittedly larger backpack 2 stroke one. I wonder how heavy a comparable battery powered one would be? Only have 4 acres to mow, currently using a 54” mower, I haven’t seen an electric one in that size.

I’m thinking that a yard service would be using their equipment most hours of the day with the only downtime during moves from job sites. Perhaps a solar rapid charger could fill all those tools while driving 15 minutes to the next job?

2 cycle engines are especially bad. They’ll put an asthmatic into an attack super fast. Stink up a whole neighbourhood with visible pollution. No wonder everybody wants them gone.

Our ryobi batteries are at least 8 years old and work fine so maybe you hit a bad batch.

No solar charger required. Just a small AGM bank in the service trailer and an inverter to power the chargers. Plug the trailer into the shop at night to recharge the AGM’s.

It’s an easy transition in many cases. Glad to see governments are listening to the people and forcing the change.

[77Travco]

Originally Posted by radar

Glad to see governments are listening to the people and forcing the change.

Well now... Who could argue with that???

[MCCOHENS]

Originally Posted by followingsea

If you ignore the cost of solar panels and batteries.

Up until I was 30 and got out of the navy I was one of those people that had to consider the cost of everything.

I do my own gardening because I enjoy the work.

I get that people do thing they enjoy because they can afford the cost.

But how does goverment mandating ineffective and expensive things affect the people doing your yard work?

In the world of thousand dollar mowers and 40 bucks a week to get the lawn cut I can justify a small solar panel and some golf cart batteries quite easily thank you.

[77Travco]

Originally Posted by MCCOHENS

I can justify a small solar panel and some golf cart batteries quite easily thank you.

This is what people really believe?
Over it's lifetime... My gas lawn equipment doesn't pollute any more than a set of batteries and all those other pieces that were made in a factory.
What gets me is that people actually think that going all electric will somehow end our pollution output. Energy is energy... it only changes forms. Some forms we see as pollution and some we don't.
I just hope that all the California refugees that are coming here to Texas have learned what doesn't work and will leave those ideologies back there.

[fagnaml]

I know I'm late to the discussion, but the requirement that gasoline (and presumably diesel) fueled portable generators be "zero emission generators" by 2028 exceeds my experiences as a chemical engineer and Refinery Operations Manager. The only way to make a zero emissions portable generator is to include an SCR Reactor with DEF like diesel F250 and coach owners have to convert NOx to nitrogen and water and include some type of equipment to capture CO2 from the generator. I do hope West Coast policians are not so dumb that they think California residents need to switch to "plug in" generators !!

The new California law does not prohibit a California resident from driving to Arizona or Nevada to purchase a gasoline powered lawn mower, weed-eater, generator, etc. and bringing them into California. The new California law will most definitely cause economic hardship for hurt small engine businesses and assembly plants and their employees and employees' families while doing little to help the environment.

And likewise when California bans the sale of new gasoline / diesel fueled vehicles, California residents will still be able to purchase "fossil fuels" for decades to come. Automobile dealerships in Nevada, Arizona and other states will prosper selling gasoline/diesel fueled vehicles while California auto dealerships will suffer.

I just don't understand California political thinking....

[77Travco]

... and this thread gets locked in 5, 4, 3...

[Mel556180]

Originally Posted by radar

Glad to see governments are listening to the people and forcing the change.

If that groundswell of the people demanding change to exclusively electric power is real, then government wouldn’t have to force anything: the market would respond accordingly.

[astrnmrtom]

I still can't figure out where all the electricity to power the all electric society is going to come from. It's not just finding enough to convert from fossil fuels, by 2035 and 2050 there are going to be more people and more tech industries which use large amounts of electricity.

On a small scale, the change won't make a big difference. We used chainsaws at work and I had one at home. A few years back my gas powered chainsaw dies and I bought an battery powered one. Love it. No spilled gas, no mix, no fumes. Pull the trigger, cut, let off the trigger and it stops. Sweet.

The flip side is we ran several $30,000 commercial riding mowers. Not sure how those will be replaced.

I find it interesting that small engines are a target when changing codes to prohibit lawns would have a larger impact. In the mid 70s the area in California I lived in experienced a drought and a lot of people abandoned their lawns and installed dry landscaping. Even saw AstroTurf lawns. Doing that state wide would not only reduce small engine use, it would reduce water use too. Kill two birds with one stone so to speak.

Changing codes to require buildings to be insulated better would help too. Super insulating houses and buildings would be a great way to reduce power needs.

The truth is, getting off fossil fuels is going to be immensely harder than anyone wants to admit, and it will mean huge changes to people's life styles. In turn will have huge impacts on economies. The world we live in was made and is maintained by abundant low cost energy fossil fuels provide. Most people don't want that change, otherwise the best selling vehicles for years now, wouldn't be big trucks and SUVs. People wouldn't be wanting bigger and bigger houses, and bigger and bigger RVs.

Banning small engines is an easy token change that allows people in charge to say they are doing something, freeing them from making the difficult and complex decisions that would really make change, which would be political suicide anyway.

[RVtravelz]

People that believe in going all electric are in for a rude awakening. All those solar panels, wind turbines, batteries and inverters cause pollution when being made. Don’t forget that there is a lifespan to all that equipment as well. It won’t last longer than the pollution offset to replace it in 15-20 years. Moving pollution from one source to another is simply a shell game.

[Country Road]

Originally Posted by 77Travco

This is what people really believe?
Over it's lifetime... My gas lawn equipment doesn't pollute any more than a set of batteries and all those other pieces that were made in a factory.
What gets me is that people actually think that going all electric will somehow end our pollution output. Energy is energy... it only changes forms. Some forms we see as pollution and some we don't.
I just hope that all the California refugees that are coming here to Texas have learned what doesn't work and will leave those ideologies back there.

Laws, if written, should be world wide rules that every nation has to follow, not only the US and specifically California. Otherwise, it hurts only those you’re trying to help.

[peggwn]

McCohens - Who mows your lawn for $40??? We started mowing ours again because it went to $80 in 3 years; we started at $60 and in went up each year. We have about 1/2 acre with a house, 2 sheds, trees, and a paved drive.

I remind the DW that I originally (in 1995) wanted artificial grass but she replies it cost too much then, and now we're too close to the end of a good run and it costs even more for the stuff. We love our EGo mower, weed trimmer, and blower, and the investment was only (tongue in cheek) $1,000, AND with easy monthly payments costing us about the same as having the yard mowed for those two years of payments. Oops, I need to talk to her again so she can explain again how we're saving money. It is quieter, though.

[Ldubs]

Originally Posted by astrnmrtom

I find it interesting that small engines are a target when changing codes to prohibit lawns would have a larger impact. In the mid 70s the area in California I lived in experienced a drought and a lot of people abandoned their lawns and installed dry landscaping. Even saw AstroTurf lawns. Doing that state wide would not only reduce small engine use, it would reduce water use too. Kill two birds with one stone so to speak.

My area's water company still promotes replacing lawns with native landscaping and many homes have done that. They even give cash rebates to homes making the transition. But they don't support synthetic lawns. The only negative I've heard about synthetic lawns is you lose photosynthesis.

In 2014 I had the best looking lawn in the neighborhood -- a thing to behold. Then another drought hit and lawns started turning brown. Except for mine. That is when folks realized my lawn was a fake.