Community Forums

Ann n Gene · 11-26-2018, 07:01 PM

Likely right, in the case I sighted above many of the vehicles never got out of the station and almost none got more than a mile away(that was published anyway).

AbdRahim · 11-26-2018, 08:57 PM

Easy to mistakenly use the wrong nozzle. I once did this, filling my gas tank with diesel thinking it was high test. Ouch. Fortunately no damage was done and the station was able to drain the tank.

PanJH · 11-27-2018, 06:38 AM

I'm waiting to get the "final" answer from the OP.

Stuart W · 11-27-2018, 06:50 AM

As far as I know, DEF is stored above ground in large plastic containers with metal reinforcement (that are moved with forklifts) behind a gate or fence. If the contamination is truly DEF, the above comments of self infliction sound plausible. Could it be a case of vandalism? Maybe covered by insurance? Sad story

puttin · 11-27-2018, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ann n Gene

Two points I have observed. 1. Loves trucks haul their own DEF and diesel AND in identical tankers. The trailers are kept separate BUT Loves has all day cab tractors and the driver who picks up a load may not be the same one that delivers it. For example, my brother pulls a tank and was loading farm urea fertilizer(same as def) in Woodward, Okla. and two Loves trucks were in line behind him. He got to talking to them and both were taking it to Loves stations in Arizona, so if they changed drivers you could easily see it being dumped into a diesel tank. 2. This very thing happened at a turnpike station(not a Loves) in Oklahoma last spring. It was found fairly quickly but the station paid to drain and repair about 50 vehicles so it can and has happened. It would certainly be rare and is probably not preventable. All JMHO

This scenario sounds really scary...I have to believe there must be some sort of designation to avoid this kind of error. Also, Old Biscuit's picture really underscores how difficult it could be to get confused...with the exception that you might put the nozzle in the wrong tank. Great thread...maybe the o.p. can chime in again.

FLJOE · 11-27-2018, 07:36 AM

I can only go by what my buddy told me. I don't really suspect "driver error" on his part. He is in his mid 60's and a retired fireman, been around diesels and big equipment all his life.

My soul purpose in posting is to see if anyone else experienced any issues on Thanksgiving day after maybe fueling at that Pilot (off I-65 Cornersville TN).

His receipt shows $149 in diesel and $14.35 in DEF. He fueled his truck tank and added some to an auxiliary tank in the bed or his truck, he then added his DEF to his truck DEF tank.

He pulled forward and immediately the truck didn't run right. He pulled out of the way and shut it down. He called a mobile service and the mechanic came out and changed his filters. This guy thought he picked up some water in his tank. He just didn't recognize he was looking at DEF in the filters. Anyway after the filter change the truck seemed to run okay.

Another 100 miles down the road they pull over for a rest room break or to eat, not sure. While he is stopped he decides to go ahead and add fuel out of the auxiliary tank so he does. About 10 miles or so after that he starts dropping rpms and has to get off the road.

He pumped 48 gallons at that Pilot, some in his truck tank and some in his auxiliary tank, I have no idea what the breakdown was. Maybe he only put 15 gallons in his truck tank and the rest went into his auxiliary tank, who knows.

If it was "driver error" then how does someone have a big enough brain fart to pump diesel and DEF into their truck tank plus the exact same thing to their auxiliary tank?

My buddy and I ride our Harleys in SW Florida all winter together. Last winter another buddy riding with us filled his motorcycle tank with diesel fuel at a gas stop. Him and I both know this happens. I just don't think that was what happen in this case.

FLJOE · 11-27-2018, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old-Biscuit

The same way folks pump gasoline into their diesel fuel tanks OR pump diesel into their gas tanks......
Brain fade.

Great pic. Based on your signature your truck doesn't use DEF right? That DEF nozzle is behind a door and is a totally different size.

Unplanned Tourist · 11-27-2018, 07:47 AM

Me thinks a brain fart.

Happens to the best of us!

Sorry about his luck.

puttin · 11-27-2018, 07:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FLJOE

I can only go by what my buddy told me. I don't really suspect "driver error" on his part. He is in his mid 60's and a retired fireman, been around diesels and big equipment all his life.

My soul purpose in posting is to see if anyone else experienced any issues on Thanksgiving day after maybe fueling at that Pilot (off I-65 Cornersville TN).

His receipt shows $149 in diesel and $14.35 in DEF. He fueled his truck tank and added some to an auxiliary tank in the bed or his truck, he then added his DEF to his truck DEF tank.

He pulled forward and immediately the truck didn't run right. He pulled out of the way and shut it down. He called a mobile service and the mechanic came out and changed his filters. This guy thought he picked up some water in his tank. He just didn't recognize he was looking at DEF in the filters. Anyway after the filter change the truck seemed to run okay.

Another 100 miles down the road they pull over for a rest room break or to eat, not sure. While he is stopped he decides to go ahead and add fuel out of the auxiliary tank so he does. About 10 miles or so after that he starts dropping rpms and has to get off the road.

He pumped 48 gallons at that Pilot, some in his truck tank and some in his auxiliary tank, I have no idea what the breakdown was. Maybe he only put 15 gallons in his truck tank and the rest went into his auxiliary tank, who knows.

If it was "driver error" then how does someone have a big enough brain fart to pump diesel and DEF into their truck tank plus the exact same thing to their auxiliary tank?

My buddy and I ride our Harleys in SW Florida all winter together. Last winter another buddy riding with us filled his motorcycle tank with diesel fuel at a gas stop. Him and I both know this happens. I just don't think that was what happen in this case.

This clarifies it...thanks for the reply!

TJ · 11-27-2018, 07:56 AM

Obviously, I have no first-hand knowledge of this incident, but I can't help but wonder why there was not a whole string of stopped vehicles at or near this PFJ. If the fuel at the pump was contaminated and the subject vehicle was immediately affected, one would think others would be similarly affected. I don't think each pump has a separate tank supplying it, so at least other nearby pumps would likely have dispensed the same contaminated fuel...if, indeed, it was contaminated.

Even experienced diesel operators are capable of a "brain fart." Take this from a guy who not too long ago filled his gas-powered riding lawn mower from a bright yellow diesel container!

Just my $.02 worth.

TJ

Dav L · 11-27-2018, 08:07 AM

What I can never understand is why the $10-15K repair bill?
To pump the tank? That takes an hour.
To replace the filters? another hour.
Prime the system? another hour.
So, $400-500 plus a tank of fresh fuel...
Why do the injectors need to be replaced?
The filters should have removed any non liquids pre injectors.

FLJOE · 11-27-2018, 08:11 AM

At first when I got back on the forum this morning and read the comments about my buddy getting contaminated fuel I wasn't pleased so many immediately thought it had to be operator error. I was hoping some other forum member experienced something from Thanksgiving day or had heard of something reference this Pilot station that could help my buddy out.

But then I thought, what the heck, if someone posted that I would probably be leaning toward operator error as the cause also.

I guess just looking at all the facts makes me about 99% sure it was actually contaminated fuel and not mixed at the island by my buddy.

He pulls in to get diesel and DEF. This isn't his first visit to a Pilot. He does what he does but when he leaves his truck tank is full, his auxiliary bed tank is full, and his DEF tank is full.

Now keep in mind he has the receipt showing 48 gallons of diesel and just over 5 gallons of DEF.

So for it to be operator error he would have had to pull in and at least pump some diesel into each diesel tank. Then he would have had to pump at least some DEF into his DEF tank because it got filled up somehow and we all know the huge diesel nozzle won't fit in there (take note Old Biscuit). Then after filling his DEF tank with part of the 5 gallons of DEF he would have had to stop, add some DEF in his truck diesel tank, stop again, and add the remainder of the DEF to his auxiliary diesel tank.

I honestly think the Pilot station messed up. Possibly the bulk DEF drop was done in the wrong underground tank right before he began fueling and based on what happen after he fueled maybe they stopped certain pumps later from drawing from that tank. I don't know how their system works but I have to believe he wasn't the only customer to get bad fuel. The problem was it probably would not have been another RV but a commercial vehicle.

I guess what I learned from this is if I ever experience a engine not running right after pulling away from the pumps then I will do what he did as far as having the filter changed and examined but I will go a couple steps further. I will go inside and purchase a diesel container, come back to the same pump and put a gallon of diesel in the container while my DW videos it. When the mobile tech gets there we will find some way to have the fuel properly tested before the engine gets started again no matter if the filters are changed or not.

All this thinking is great after it happens to someone else I guess.

Finance · 11-27-2018, 08:27 AM

I don't see a reason to conclude both tanks were contaminated, unless the shop that ultimately made the full repairs found that. And they certainly should have checked.

He got contaminated in his main tank- somehow- and filter change temporarily cleared it up enough to drive a while. Until the water separator was overwhelmed again by the remaining contamination. If you get WIF the thing to do is check the separator frequently until you're sure water is all gone. It can roll around in the tank, it doesn't just all come out at once. Did he ever get a WIF indicator on the dash?

Stuart W · 11-27-2018, 08:36 AM

You have done the best thing for your friend you could by putting it out there in case others had the same experience. Have you tried googling the station to see if others have said anything about the station. Who determined that the contamination was DEF? Did they send a fuel sample out to have it tested?