More winter camping issues...heat

[kb2ztx]

So this morning I was awoken about 3AM and it was about 43 in the motor home. I went to the stove and found it still lit and worked so knew i had propane. Shut off furnace and turned back on. It started blowing warm air. not hot but semi warm. Going out in the frigid -20 the outside is blowing hot air o assume the cool/warm i feel inside is due ot the fact its -20 outside....

Anyway furnace will run for 30 minutes then shut down. The only way to restart is to shut it off. wait 15 minutes then turn it back on. I have the motor home up to about 0 between the furnace, 2 eden pure heaters and the chassis engine running now, but need to figure out whats up with the furnace.

I looked at the book and it doesn't list a run time but is it possible it is overheating, even though i dont get super warm air inside ? Looking at my manuals it pulls fresh air from under my bed and i double checked all the vents for blockages. Everything has been fine prior to us hitting -negative temperatures.

[Hit_the_Rhod]

It is possible that your "propane" was filled further south, or in warmer climate? I have heard that just as diesel is "blended" differently during cold weather to reduce the possibility of gelling, propane that has more butane in it can be problematic in cold weather. And you stated it is -20 where you are. Are you hooked up to shore power? It sounds like you are. If my propane tank were below half, I would consider filling it locally, also get more electric heaters if you are plugged in and have amperage available. Is you coach 30 amp or 50 amp? Either way, if you are plugged into a campground power pedestal, you may be able to supplement power by running an additional heavy duty extension cord to the 20 amp plug on the pedestal for another heater. If you are not using oil filled heaters, make sure that they have tip over protection and are located in safe locations. If you have a slide, you might consider pulling in to conserve volume you are attempting to heat as well.

Your profile says upstate NY, but you don't state where you are right now. If hunkered down for the winter, do you have skirting around the base of the coach? Straw bales work great, and fast to put in place. It will reduce you heat loss significantly. Keep us advised

[lynnmor]

It might be a pressure drop from the propane, try lighting a stove burner and see if the flame gets lower as the furnace runs. Moisture in the propane is a possibility. At low temperatures, pressure drops in a propane tank and if the flow has any restriction you might not have adequate supply to the furnace.

[raineman]

That sounds dangerously cold. Be careful and stay safe.

[70ChevelleSS]

At -20 you have 12.5% of the BTUs available from propane as compared to 0 degrees. As the propane level in the tank drops that also decreases the BTUs available. Both the temp and the tank level affect the rate the propane vaporizes and hence the BTUs available. At -44 propane won't vaporize at all.

Now having said all that I'm not sure why the furnace would shut down. At those temps you wouldn't expect it to over heat unless there's a blockage in the ducts. I'm not sure where the return to the furnace is. It may be under the bed but I know the air filter under the bed is for the basement A/C, heat pump unit not the furnace.

[Blastvalve]

I would speculate with the others that it’s tied to the drop in propane pressure from the cold either not giving your furnace enough pressure or fooling your flow regulator. We run into similar problems with balloons when flying in the winter, the cold greatly reduces the pressure in the propane tank, which in turn greatly affects the performance of the burner. In the summer, the output from the propane tank is about 80-110psi depending on ambient air temp, in the winter when its this cold it can be around 30-40psi. At that pressure, the running joke is a Bic lighter is more effective is hearing the balloon.

We have a few ways to overcome this when flying in the winter, for you I would suggest trying to SAFELY warm the propane tank (water bed heaters are popular in the balloon world for balloons not equipped with tank heating systems) and see if that fixes your problem.

Caution is needed here, warming the propane does bring the pressure back, too much heat/pressure and your relief valve is going to kick in on the tank and you will see your tank empty out very quickly (That’s the best case scenario, you are playing with a flammable gas here)

1st and foremost, please stay safe, not sure where you are in NY but here in VT it’s gonna be this cold (currently 9 below) for at least another week. Many towns have warming shelters setup for situations like this, please use them if you can’t get this fixed!

[kb2ztx]

Thanks All. Im in the Tug Hill area of Central NY. Its about -12 now. I used the stove fine for cooking breakfast. I have been getting tanks filled locally but suspect the cold is messing with the vapor. I am using 30# cylinders with an extend-a-stay. I am wondering if the small T is freezing up with the furnace running hence furnace not getting enough propane. I have some fuel in the on board tank and as soon as it gets a bit warmer I'll go out and turn that tank on and try it also. We switched to the portable tanks as i can't go fill up weekly with the on board.

We had a 100# on the unit but it ran out and with holiday hours no place will fill it until tomorrow.

I was able to get some heat by running the chassis engine with the heat running and also have a small Buddy Heater running now, but the basement is still showing 20' and our water is still frozen. I have a small 200 watt heater in the bay, but its no chance at these temps.

[Cooperhawk]

When I first moved back to Minnesoooota from the South it got down to -36 below one morning. The propane dealer who had just installed our new gas furnace called to tell me that the propane might quit working if it got any colder. "What the heck you mean quit working?"

He said to start a fire near the tank with some firewood. "I don think so!"

Then he said pour some hot water over the tank and that will start it up again. I did and it did.

He was joking about the fire, I think.

[Concord]

-20 is really tough. As previously posted, propane does not vaporize well at these temps. -And furnace does shutdown (keeps blowing cold air) when this happens. My best recommendation (tough to find on New Years day) is to find a Truck wash or a large Truck repair shop/tire garage that will let you pull in for the day. I had one "save me" once when all was freezing up. Yea, I gave them $100 bucks for saving my bacon.

[Jthigh]

I saw another post on this and someone recommended using a big water bed heater (or heat tape used on water lines) to wrap around the LP tank or getting a portable electric heat to blow warm air on the tank. Just be sure to monitor the temp and be safe about the electrical connection. I have never done this but one of them may be an option.

[Jthigh]

Safety is the first and main concern so not sure how viable those suggestions are.

[kb2ztx]

Originally Posted by Concord

-20 is really tough. As previously posted, propane does not vaporize well at these temps. -And furnace does shutdown (keeps blowing cold air) when this happens. My best recommendation (tough to find on New Years day) is to find a Truck wash or a large Truck repair shop/tire garage that will let you pull in for the day. I had one "save me" once when all was freezing up. Yea, I gave them $100 bucks for saving my bacon.

I would love to do that, but i'm all froze in at this point. I have half the camper skirted with foam insulation board, with the other side along a car port. MY parents have a small house here so I think I will carry the other full tank into their house to warm(basement area). I have been storing full tanks outside next to the camper. Maybe if they are stored inside at least they will work a bit better to start. I'll be honest earlier in the year when i said i would be doing this no one mentioned my furnace or refrigerator not working when it got cold.

Up until this point we have been able to keep water flowing but with no furnace the basement even with electric heaters is down to 20 degrees. I'll go grab some more insulation board also today and try to fill in more of the skirting to see if it helps. I had thought about stray but was advised against it as little critters like it. Also i was worried about the paint on the camper. The insulation board at least is stiff enough to wedge between the ground and the chassis/compartments. Only issue will be the front. Wind comes from South mostly so started it that area.

The original goal was to be in a RV Carport/enclosure but after purchasing online I got told they wouldn't install until April ! I hope to be in VA come April and not deal with this stuff...

[Concord]

If I were in your position, - With much of the basement "sealed" from the wind, I'd put plywood, foam or whatever to seal the rest, and place a knipco under there (6 feet from anything combustible). They can put out tremendous BTUs - enough to warm the lp tank and get everything going... If there's enough LP, it's probably not the tank, but the regulator. In any event, you need to get things defrosted!

Winter camping is okay, even down into the single digits. I've learned that beyond that, it becomes more of "survival" than camping. Good luck!

[dexters]

Originally Posted by kb2ztx

So this morning I was awoken about 3AM and it was about 43 in the motor home.

If you are hooked up to electric get an oil heater from Walmart ($35?) it will save you a great deal of money.