Tire Problems

[Steve Hoover]

Recently had new tires put on my 5W at Camping World in Tuscon (same tires that came on the RV when new--Goodyear). After travelling from Tuscon to Deming, New Mexico, I check the lug nuts. Everything fine. Drove from Deming to Alpine, Texas. Checked again...fine. Drove from Alpine to San Angelo, then on to home base (Granbury, Texas). However, 70 miles from home, the two tires on the left side of the RV completely came off (Rims and tires)!!!! Yikes, it was a mess but no injury, just damage to RV. I was wondering if anyone has ever had this type of problem after having new tires, particulary at Camping World?

[timetogo]

Bummer. My dealer says to check, re-torque lugs after 50 miles on new tire change.

[mo5er]

Camping World installed a new set of tires on my previous 5th wheel. Put about 6,000 miles on them with no problems.

p.s. sorry about the damage to the rv

[BFlinn181]

Sorry about your issue, but I don't think Camping World is to blame. You said you drove from Tucson to Deming, then checked lug nuts. That's over 200 miles, as timetogo mentioned, most tire dealers suggest you check at 50 miles. Then you drove to Alpine, TX, another 320 miles. About 350 miles after that second check, the wheels fell off?

How did you check the lug nuts, did you use a torque wrench? Are you sure they were tight to specs each time? Did you notice any change in tightness each check? Both tires, on separate axles came off at the same time? Very puzzling, but again, I don't see how any tire dealer could be blamed for your very unusual mechanical failure.

[FixerCQI]

Just wondering if you jacked the wheel up off the ground before checking it. I'm thinking the lug nuts would resist turning much more with the weight of the moho on them, giving you an incorrect idea of how tight they were. If they were actually OK at the first check then they should have been good to go the future.

[Tony Lee]

Pretty rare to jack the vehicle up when final-torquing wheel nuts.

My guess is nuts were checked visually and nuts came loose because of particular road conditions - or more likely there was some other catastrophic failure - perhaps caused by broken studs resulting from massive overtorquing by tyre jocky using a huge rattle gun.

Need more info from OP - were all the studs broken or intact and just the nuts missing??

If all the studs were broken, then you need to get that installer to replace EVERY stud on EVERY wheel because if you don't, you are going to go through this same hassle three more times.

BTW - it isn't a tyre problem

[FixerCQI]

I agree it's rare to jack when torquing, however I still feel it is good practice for the following reason. The nuts loosen for a number of reasons, but lets assume the OPS lugs were not torqued enough. There has to be enough torque on the nuts to apply a clamping force between the wheel and the hub which creates enough friction to bear the load on the axle. It is this friction which carries most of the load because the studs are not designed to do it.
Left side lug nuts tend to loosen and fall off before the studs break, because the loose wheel actually applies rotational force counter clockwise on the nuts when the wheel is being driven forward. Right side nuts tend to be tightened, but not enough, and the loose wheel is now applying all the load to the studs which eventually fail from reversed bending fatigue, and they just snap suddenly.
If the nuts are loose then the wheel is positioned slightly off center and at a slight angle to the axle. This position allows for a great amount of force to be applied by the wedging effect of the wheel on the nuts which becomes increased friction, which requires increased torque to overcome when the weight of the motor home is bearing on them. If you try to torque at the specified torque you are not applying enough torque to the nut because much more than normal is lost in this new friction.
Another cause of loosening after torquing correctly is failure of the contact surface between the wheel and the hub. The hub can have oxidation as well as the wheel (be it aluminum or steel) and the oxidation breaks down under the clamping force and eventually it is enough to reduce the stretch on the lugs (torque) because the length of the materials held in the "clamp" are getting shorter. This is usually not the case in a new motor home.
This is all food for though at the very least, but hopefully it can save further incidents like the OPS.

[mel s]

Originally Posted by Steve Hoover

Recently had new tires put on my 5W at Camping World in Tuscon
70 miles from home, the two tires on the left side of the RV completely came off (Rims and tires)!!!!

Steve Hoover
That is a perfect example of Camping World's "quality service".
Will people never learn???
Mel
'96 Safari

[TQ60]

Get a torque wrench and check the rest against the spec.

I suspect way to tight if studs broken or too loose but feel tight if studs present.

Check torque and report back.

[BFlinn181]

Originally Posted by FixerCQI

Just wondering if you jacked the wheel up off the ground before checking it. I'm thinking the lug nuts would resist turning much more with the weight of the moho on them, giving you an incorrect idea of how tight they were. If they were actually OK at the first check then they should have been good to go the future.

I've changed many a tire and have never torqued a lug nut with the tire out of contact of the ground. Yes, when initially mounting the wheel on the hub the tire is off the ground, but after a slight tightening to get each conical shaped nut centered in the bowl shaped opening in the wheel. Once centered, you lower the axle to put full weight on the tire so the wheel doesn't turn while torquing to spec.

We still haven't been told how the OP 'checked' the wheels twice in the 900+ miles he drove after leaving Tucson. I also fail to see how Camping World or any tire shop could be held responsible that far down the road. In my RV, on the wall next to the driver is the following:

[jpharley]

Wow, we may be over cautious but according to our manufacturer, once a wheel has been off, the tightness should be check at 25 mile intervals with a proper torque wrench until they no longer are loose. We find that we are fine at around 150 miles of checks. Then we check the torque and air pressure every travel day. Lug nuts tend to loosen on aluminum rims. Is this a pain, yes. But we have always been able to find a place to pull off, even on two lane roads to make the checks.

[Steve Hoover]

I did not use a torque wrench (but I certainly will in the future). Both wheels came off on the left side of RV. Thanks for your response.

[Steve Hoover]

Thanks for your reply. All the studs were broken off completely on the front tire and 4 studs on the rear tire were broken off. In addition, two studs on the right side of the RV were stripped (cross threaded?). The tire shop discovered this when they were checking all tires. I will take your advice and have all studs replaced. Thanks again.

[cwit]

Have them hand York and use a tork wrench. Don't let them use a impact gun.