Special Non Commercial Class A License for Pennsylvania

[07Ram5500]

And when you are helping you friend move his furniture, you can't say-

He's paying for fuel
He's paying for tolls
He's buying me lunch/food
He owes me a favor
We'll figure it out later
We traded for it

And my favorite,
He's giving me a hug, a hand shake, a thank you, etc.

He is my friend, that's all.

[07Ram5500]

Originally Posted by Doc12

07 Ram
Where did you get the info on trailer over 10,001? That was what I was told but can not find anything in print.
When I have told several people they do not believe it.

Now when I read it, PA DMV, is it one long run-on sentence or is it 2 different statements?

So if vehicle GVWR is 19,500 towing a 7000 trailer,
GCWR is over 26,001 (26,500) but the trailer is under 10,000 (7,000).
This does not need a class A? Even though GCWR is over 26,001.

[mikeski0890]

Originally Posted by 07Ram5500

So if vehicle GVWR is 19,500 towing a 7000 trailer,
GCWR is over 26,001 (26,500) but the trailer is under 10,000 (7,000).
This does not need a class A? Even though GCWR is over 26,001.

Hey guys i am new here but just talked with a DOT Office about this particular item yesterday as i am going for my Non-Commercial Class A on Tuesday next week. The confusion comes in with the "or", I was told by the DOT officer that in order to need the class A you have to have BOTH a GCWR over 26,001 AND a trailer with a GVWR in excess of 10,001. For more clarity you can reference figure 1.1 on page 14 of the CDL Manual for PA: https://www.dot.state.pa.us/public/D.../PUB%20223.pdf

[Superburban]

Originally Posted by 07Ram5500
So if vehicle GVWR is 19,500 towing a 7000 trailer,
GCWR is over 26,001 (26,500) but the trailer is under 10,000 (7,000).
This does not need a class A? Even though GCWR is over 26,001.

Originally Posted by mikeski0890

Hey guys i am new here but just talked with a DOT Office about this particular item yesterday as i am going for my Non-Commercial Class A on Tuesday next week. The confusion comes in with the "or", I was told by the DOT officer that in order to need the class A you have to have BOTH a GCWR over 26,001 AND a trailer with a GVWR in excess of 10,001.

Correct, BUT he will need the class B Non CDL. If one has the equipment, it likely best to get the class A Non CDL to begin with, then you are good to go for any Non Commercial vehicle, hauling a non commercial trailer.


As mentioned, anything that is not clearly recreational, can be questionable if it comes under commercial. As I said in another thread, this whole recreational heavy vehicle deal is still new to many states, and they are still working out the hows and whys of what it needs to handle a large vehicle.

[geotexZ71]

Hey everyone!

LONG time since I posted! Had a hiatus from RVing but have returned to it. Living in PA for 3 years now and have been towing a 2015 Heritage Glen Lite 232IS with a 2004 Yukon 2500XL. Easy!

However, our family has grown and we've been setting sights on upgrading and wanting to go 5er.
We thought that was 3 years out, but in May a tornado destroyed the Yukon (roof landed on it).

In looking for a new tow vehicle, I came across a creampuff 2015 RAM 3500 Cummins/AISIN dually with a GVWR of 14K that I bought 2 weeks ago. I do not need a non-commercial A to tow the Heritage Glen, but it's up for sale and we're targeting a 5er with GVWR of about 15K. Don't know when the Heritage Glen will sell because we live in an off-the-beaten path area, but when it does we are buying the 5er.

I'd like to prepare and be legal for the tow home when we buy. I just don't want to risk it because the only luck I have is bad! Lol.

I was wondering if any fellow campers in the greater Reading area, Allentown, or in Berks or LeHigh County would be willing to help me get my Class A? I'm happy to pay for time and effort to be able to take the skills/road test.

I thought I was set because a friend in NJ has a CDL A and he brought his dually truck and gooseneck cargo trailer for me to do the skills. We were floored when the instructor refused to test me because the properly registered and insured and inspected combination were out of state and my buddy, holding a current CDL A driving semis for a living, did not have a PA license! NOWHERE can I find a written requirement for PA vehicle and trailer and PA driver with appropriate class.

Thanks for the consideration!

[ccasch]

Some current data from the field...

Just took the NYS R test. My sponsor driver has a CDL-B (dump truck) certificate.

Anyways, test:
drove around a town square first with right turns, then left. Then instructed to back up a hundred feet (went to exit and have a look and inspector said 'you're okay to stay in the vehicle-just use your mirrors and cameras'; then I was instructed to parallel park it. That was it.
YMMV with inspectors of course.

[Tdave]

Since this seems to be the place to talk about our PA Non-Com Class A Adventures, I figured I’d post my own story:

It’s been 2 years since I started this quest.

It took multiple trips to the DMV, and hours on the phone to NJDOT, to clear up a speeding ticket I got in NJ in the 80s that popped when PA ran my license on the National Drivers Register (forgot about that one).

Then I finally got my permit in November, 2019.

Then I spent hours and hours getting my truck reclassified from 5 to 10 due to multiple rejections from PenDOT without explanation.

Then I spent more time and money requesting a duplicate registration and class sticker when they got lost in the mail.

And then, today, I finally took my driver test in Norristown.

I passed, but I still don’t have my license.

Some time along the way, the ID requirements were updated, now requiring you to present birth certificate or passport to process the license reissue.

So now I need to go back to the DMV.... again!

FYI to those with a drivers test scheduled.

At least I’m now technically legal.

[BFlinn181]

T.S.A. is requiring stricter regulations for 'Real ID-compliant driver's licenses' for ID in border crossings or air travel.

Most states have upped their requirements, but a driver's license a couple of years old might not allow you to fly without a passport after Oct. 1, 2020. To see if your license is compliant with the new Homeland Security requirements, look for a STAR on the upper right corner of your license. If there is one, your good to fly. If not, take your birth certificate to the DMV and get a new license or make sure your passport hasn't expired.

[KanzKran]

Originally Posted by BFlinn181

T.S.A. is requiring stricter regulations for 'Real ID-compliant driver's licenses' for ID in border crossings or air travel.

Most states have upped their requirements, but a driver's license a couple of years old might not allow you to fly without a passport after Oct. 1, 2020. To see if your license is compliant with the new Homeland Security requirements, look for a STAR on the upper right corner of your license. If there is one, your good to fly. If not, take your birth certificate to the DMV and get a new license or make sure your passport hasn't expired.

Or an American flag somewhere on it, and the banner “Enhanced”. It’s one step higher than a Real ID in that it allows land and water crossings to Canada and Mexico without a passport. Does not allow air travel to those places, or any other country, without a passport, but it still allows you to get through airport security. As will the passport. Only 5 or 6 northern border states issue those, though, and they require proof of citizenship in addition to other forms of ID and proof of residence and such.

[thomasd923]

I think that only applies if you want the real ID. Other than that you should have been given the updated pic. That’s how I did mine

[Tdave]

Originally Posted by thomasd923

I think that only applies if you want the real ID. Other than that you should have been given the updated pic. That’s how I did mine

Nope. I went back yesterday to finish the deed, and providing them my passport only got me a normal (not Real ID) license.

Also, my original license expired in May, 2020, and so does this one. So I have to go back to the DMV in a couple months again. Sigh.

[jpmader]

Originally Posted by Tdave

Since this seems to be the place to talk about our PA Non-Com Class A Adventures, I figured I’d post my own story:

It’s been 2 years since I started this quest.

It took multiple trips to the DMV, and hours on the phone to NJDOT, to clear up a speeding ticket I got in NJ in the 80s that popped when PA ran my license on the National Drivers Register (forgot about that one).

Then I finally got my permit in November, 2019.

Then I spent hours and hours getting my truck reclassified from 5 to 10 due to multiple rejections from PenDOT without explanation.

Then I spent more time and money requesting a duplicate registration and class sticker when they got lost in the mail.

And then, today, I finally took my driver test in Norristown.

I passed, but I still don’t have my license.

Some time along the way, the ID requirements were updated, now requiring you to present birth certificate or passport to process the license reissue.

So now I need to go back to the DMV.... again!

FYI to those with a drivers test scheduled.

At least I’m now technically legal.

You're probably not going to want to hear this, but, as of April 2019, you no longer need to register your truck with combination weight as long as you re-title your fifth wheel as a "recreational trailer" at your local notary. It costs about $50 to re-title, a lot cheaper than a $700/year Class 10 truck registration. I had to fight PennDot and escalate to my local legislator, but, he got me a refund when the legislation passed after PennDot told me that it didn't apply to me, when it did. Here is the bulletin that you need to take with you to the notary so that they know what you want them to do:
https://www.dot.state.pa.us/public/D...0Act%20138.pdf

[Tdave]

Originally Posted by jpmader

You're probably not going to want to hear this, but, as of April 2019, you no longer need to register your truck with combination weight as long as you re-title your fifth wheel as a "recreational trailer" at your local notary. It costs about $50 to re-title, a lot cheaper than a $700/year Class 10 truck registration. I had to fight PennDot and escalate to my local legislator, but, he got me a refund when the legislation passed after PennDot told me that it didn't apply to me, when it did. Here is the bulletin that you need to take with you to the notary so that they know what you want them to do:
https://www.dot.state.pa.us/public/D...0Act%20138.pdf

Wow!

This amendment was all happening exactly when I was reclassifying the truck. No wonder none of the tag agencies I spoke with knew about it (not that they knew much about non-com Class A requirements anyway).

So after getting the trailer title reclassified, I can apply for a refund on the balance of my truck’s registration and re-title it as a Class 5?

[Tdave]

Originally Posted by jpmader

You're probably not going to want to hear this, but, as of April 2019, you no longer need to register your truck with combination weight as long as you re-title your fifth wheel as a "recreational trailer" at your local notary. It costs about $50 to re-title, a lot cheaper than a $700/year Class 10 truck registration. I had to fight PennDot and escalate to my local legislator, but, he got me a refund when the legislation passed after PennDot told me that it didn't apply to me, when it did. Here is the bulletin that you need to take with you to the notary so that they know what you want them to do:
https://www.dot.state.pa.us/public/D...0Act%20138.pdf

And I financed my 5th wheel, so I don’t have a copy of my title. Are you saying that it wouldn’t have been titled as a recreational trailer? It’s a 2018 model year, for what it’s worth.

And if it were re-titled as a recreational trailer, how does that exempt it from the combination weight registration regulations?