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Old 10-03-2020, 12:06 PM   #1
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90 Pace Arrow Running Issues

Hey all, I am new here and have a 1990 Pace Arrow with a TBI 454. I've been doing a ton of research using this forum and several others for the past two weeks with no luck yet.

I purchased the rig in June, drove it about 70 miles home with no issues. Have had the rig parked in storage while remodeling the interior and drove it once more about 2 miles down the road to get more gasoline with no issues either. Now after putting about 40 gallons of fuel in the tank, the engine has a rough time starting, when it does start it will not stay running. I can feather the gas pedal and keep it running. I also cannot get the generator to start, but my main concern is the engine itself.

Due to the generator not starting also, I assume it is the fuel pump but am trying to avoid dropping the tank if I don't have to. I also would like to replace the entire sending unit if I have to drop the tank but cannot find a part number for the sending unit. I have also already replace the fuel filter with no luck remedying the issue.

So for the questions I currently have:

1: Am I right to suspect the fuel pump?
2: Does somebody have a part number for the sending unit and also for just the pump to make sure I found the correct pump?
3: Where is the fuel pump relay located? I have read this could be the issue if it has a fuel pump relay.
4: What is the easiest way to drop the tank if need be, being on a gravel lot and no way to move the rig out of the lot?
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Old 10-03-2020, 11:55 PM   #2
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Hi! Welcome to the forum. I'm sure you will find the answers here for your issues.
I wouldn't think the in tank fuel pump would have any effect on the generator, as the generator 'should' have its own fuel pump.
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Old 10-04-2020, 12:24 AM   #3
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You might have lost fuel pressure. Check to see if you have between 9-12 psi on a 1990. This web site speaks about the smaller TBI engine, but the 454 is similar.
https://troubleshootmyvehicle.com/gm...el-pump-test-1
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Old 10-04-2020, 01:49 PM   #4
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HarryStone,
My understanding was that the fuel pump was the same for both, and the sending unit is what diverted gas to the generator not a separate pump. If there is a separate pump for the generator where would it be located?

D Gardiner,
I rented a pressure tester and got 0 psi, but I did not turn the engine over, just had the key in the ON position. To properly test, do I need to start the engine, or at least attempt to start it?
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Old 10-04-2020, 02:37 PM   #5
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I don't know exactly on your rig. You should have fuel pressure when turning the key to the run position, and you actually should be able to hear the fuel pump prime for a couple seconds. If not, check the fuel pump fuse first, then the relay, and then the pump itself. Having a volt/ohm meter comes in handy.
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Old 10-04-2020, 11:38 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slm32123 View Post
D Gardiner,
I rented a pressure tester and got 0 psi, but I did not turn the engine over, just had the key in the ON position. To properly test, do I need to start the engine, or at least attempt to start it?
You are correct, as soon as you turn the key ON the fuel pump should have primed the system for a second or two and you should have seen a pressure reading.
Depending how much fuel escaped in the time you were hooking up the pressure tester, you may want to turn the key ON a couple times to fully prime. If you still get a 0 psi reading, go ahead and crank the engine for a few seconds.
If you still get no pressure reading, you can test the fuel pump relay.

On our 1995 chassis, the fuel pump relay is on the left metal rail, in the engine compartment, forward of the A/C compressor.
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Old 10-06-2020, 01:33 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by D Gardiner View Post
You are correct, as soon as you turn the key ON the fuel pump should have primed the system for a second or two and you should have seen a pressure reading.
Depending how much fuel escaped in the time you were hooking up the pressure tester, you may want to turn the key ON a couple times to fully prime. If you still get a 0 psi reading, go ahead and crank the engine for a few seconds.
If you still get no pressure reading, you can test the fuel pump relay.

On our 1995 chassis, the fuel pump relay is on the left metal rail, in the engine compartment, forward of the A/C compressor.
I replaced the fuel pump relay anyways just incase. I think the tester I rented may have been faulty. I appear to be getting fuel, as the injectors have a good even spray of fuel and an even pattern.

I have ordered a bunch of replacement parts on Amazon with most arriving tomorrow. I am going to replace the oil pressure sender first as I have read that a faulty oil pressure sender can cutoff the fuel pump.

I am also getting a new alternator as the current one is squeaking quite a bit while running (bearings giving out).

I plan to replace one part at a time and test running the engine to figure out what is causing the issue in my case here.

Thank you for your help thus far!
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Old 10-07-2020, 01:26 PM   #8
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Check with your local electrical motor repair shop for the bearings on the alternator. Many times, the repair is cheaper than the new part
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Old 10-07-2020, 01:50 PM   #9
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First thing to check is fuel filter not sure if there is one or two ! i had one on the right side frame rail iust behind the front seat passenger side and one on the engine .Been a while since i owned a 90 model but I think there was two
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Old 10-12-2020, 01:36 PM   #10
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Hey all,
I have replaced a number of parts. It is running better than it was but still sputtering/bogging down at intermittent times, primarily during idle.

Fuel filter has been replaced, not sure if there is a second one though, I will have to take a look.

Parts that I have replaced are as follows:
-Alternator - Definitely was bad, was putting out right about 12V new is about 13.8-14V
-Oil Pressure Sensor - Definitely was bad, always read 50-60 psi at idle, new reads about 30-40 psi at idle.
-Fuel Pump Relay
-Fuel Filter
-All fuses
-MAP Sensor
-Cap
-Rotor
-Plugs
-Plug Wires
-Ignition Coil
-Ignition Control Module
-PCV Valve

I am not too sure what else to test, or replace. It's getting a bit frustrating at this point. Especially since the engine was running perfect one day, then having this issue the next.
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Old 10-16-2020, 11:35 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by swampdog2 View Post
First thing to check is fuel filter not sure if there is one or two ! i had one on the right side frame rail iust behind the front seat passenger side and one on the engine .Been a while since i owned a 90 model but I think there was two
I checked for a second fuel filter but I do not have a second filter. The only one I have is mounted in the frame rail near the rear axle.

Next thing I am replacing is the injectors.

Another question. Should my plugs be gapped at .035 or .045? The ones in it that I just replaced were at .045, and I read that gap is for HEI systems. My understanding is that HEI is a cap mounted coil, vs min the coil is mounted in a bracket beside the distributor.
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Old 10-16-2020, 01:44 PM   #12
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There are auto repair places that can clean and rebuild injectors, usually at a cheaper cost than replacing them.
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Old 10-16-2020, 04:09 PM   #13
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Stop throwing parts at this in an attempt to repair a problem that has not been properly diagnosed. If you can't diagnose it then you need to find professional help. You already said that the injectors have a good spray pattern but are going to replace them anyway. Really ?
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Old 10-16-2020, 04:51 PM   #14
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There are auto repair places that can clean and rebuild injectors, usually at a cheaper cost than replacing them.
I was able to find new injectors for around $50 each locally. Next time I need to replace injectors I will definitely take your advice and check around for rebuild possibilities.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy-c View Post
Stop throwing parts at this in an attempt to repair a problem that has not been properly diagnosed. If you can't diagnose it then you need to find professional help. You already said that the injectors have a good spray pattern but are going to replace them anyway. Really ?
I personally don't trust taking my vehicles to mechanics unless it gets to a point of being something that I am completely unable to do myself which is generally due to not having the space to work on it living in an apartment.

From what I could tell looking at the spray pattern, they looked decent, but I don't know for certain as they have a different spray pattern than all of my other vehicles I work on. I also have the understanding that with 56k miles on the rig, and 2 injectors spraying for 4 cylinders each, it is near the equivalent of those original injectors from 30 years ago having roughly 224k miles.

Additionally, I would much rather throw in the $400 - $500 of parts myself rather than be horrendously overcharged for someone else to do it. Just to give you an idea, the least expensive quote I received on fuel pump replacement was $1200 in my area, that is including the $80 fuel pump that they wanted to charge me $360 for, so no thanks I will do work myself while I can and when I can.

Also, I see nothing wrong with replacing all replaceable parts with new parts since I will be moving into this rig full time in January and driving thousands upon thousands of miles.

But thank you for your feedback.
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