Community Forums

jespo27 · 11-29-2021, 02:38 PM

I want to install the Progressive Industries hard wired 30 amp surge protector on my RV . My Generator is a cummins onan RVQG 4000 with a southwire surge guard ATS # 41300. I was told by onan that my generator is not neutral bonded. I called progressive industries and was told their hard wired 30 amp surge protector would not provide all features unless generator was neutral bonded. What i understand so far is that the Prog Ind surge protector should be installed before the ATS. What I do not know is how do i create a neutral bond for the generator , or possibly the Auto transfer switch (which is more accessible and preferred by me) so I can access all features of surge protector. My generator has no plugs on it , as the progressive tech said if it had , I could use a dongle to accomplish neutral bond. I have searched this site and google, you tubed and have not found a definitive way to do this.
Any help is appreciated.

Steve-W · 11-29-2021, 02:55 PM

If you are installing the PI surge protector before the ATS the generator output will not be feeding through the PI, Thus whether it is natural bonded or not is irrelavant.

If my prior coach I hardwired a PI EMS unit after the transfer switch at the distribution panel. I had no issues with function with a Onan QD4000 generator. Many users of the PI install then this way with no issues on generator operation.

MtCamper · 11-29-2021, 02:59 PM

My PI is a 30 amp hard wired unit with a wall display showing voltage and such. It has a switch I can use that allows me to bypass it when I run the generator. I've also build a pigtail I can use that bonds the common and the ground. When I can find it and use it I no longer need to switch on the bypass. I'm thinking you just need to bond the common to the ground leg. Unless you are burying a metal rod you're not grounded anyway. The PI senses any difference in potential between the two legs, sort of like a GFI does. I'm sure someone will chime in with a much better explanation, it's been a loooong time since i took circuits in physics class. Generally I know just enough to not burn down anything.

twinboat · 11-29-2021, 03:18 PM

The ATS is supposed to do the bonding, when it locks into generator mode.

Bagger97 · 11-29-2021, 03:59 PM

If install the EMS unit on your power cord it won’t be used when on generator. That is after the fact and doesn’t need EMS protection.

jespo27 · 11-29-2021, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MtCamper

My PI is a 30 amp hard wired unit with a wall display showing voltage and such. It has a switch I can use that allows me to bypass it when I run the generator. I've also build a pigtail I can use that bonds the common and the ground. When I can find it and use it I no longer need to switch on the bypass. I'm thinking you just need to bond the common to the ground leg. Unless you are burying a metal rod you're not grounded anyway. The PI senses any difference in potential between the two legs, sort of like a GFI does. I'm sure someone will chime in with a much better explanation, it's been a loooong time since i took circuits in physics class. Generally I know just enough to not burn down anything.

so if i understand correctly, I install the hard wire PI unit after the Auto trans switch. which would put it between the ATS and gen, then use the pigtail wire to connect the neutral and ground in the progressive power box on the input side of the PI power box. and that would give all functions on remote without having to use bypass switch on PI remote?
Im new at this and i apologize for my ignorance on this situation.

jespo27 · 11-29-2021, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steve-W

If you are installing the PI surge protector before the ATS the generator output will not be feeding through the PI, Thus whether it is natural bonded or not is irrelavant.

If my prior coach I hardwired a PI EMS unit after the transfer switch at the distribution panel. I had no issues with function with a Onan QD4000 generator. Many users of the PI install then this way with no issues on generator operation.

so you are saying install at distribution panel inside coach and not where the gen and ATS is located?

Steve-W · 11-30-2021, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jespo27

so you are saying install at distribution panel inside coach and not where the gen and ATS is located?

Yes that is how I installed it when I had my Forester. I removed the 30 amp (10 gauge) romex feed from the distribution panel ran it to the PI then added a 3’ jumper of romex from the PI back to the distribution panel. The PI was in circuit when I was on shore power or genny. No issues or the need to bond the ground and neutral. I did not need to bypass the PI when on genny.

THenne1713 · 12-15-2021, 07:12 PM

You can safely bond them ONLY at the (Portable GEN), and NEVER in the RV, BECAUSE IF Neutral wire broke in the SHORELINE/PLUG, the RV can be a HOTSKIN RISK AND KILL YA. OTHERWISE, EVEN IN A HoUSE w/ a SUB-PANEL, you do not bond in the sub-panel, for the same reasons.

CharlesinGA · 12-16-2021, 09:15 PM

I had a class C, Winnebago View that used the shore plugged into the the outlet for the generator, instead of a ATS, sort of a manual xfer switch. I installed the PI HW30 with the shore cord feeding it so that any power going thru the shore cord, be it the generator or the campground pedestal, went thru the PI HW30 and then to the breaker panel inside. This was an Onan 3600L which ia the same as the 4000 gas. I never had any issues and it worked as advertised.

The transfer switch switches the neutral and the hot (all grounds are tied together). and you should not have any problems with installation.

I assume you are wanting to put it after the ATS so it checks both the genny and the shore power, whatever is going to the panel. Some people say to not do this but I wanted to check the genny for volts, Hz, and amps also.

Charles