RV News RVBusiness 2021 Top 10 RVs of the Year, plus 56 additional debuts and must-see units → ×
RV Trip Planning Discussions

Go Back   iRV2 Forums > MOTORHOME FORUMS > MH-General Discussions & Problems
Click Here to Login
Join iRV2 Today

Mission Statement: Supporting thoughtful exchange of knowledge, values and experience among RV enthusiasts.
Reply
  This discussion is proudly sponsored by:
Please support our sponsors and let them know you heard about their products on iRV2
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 12-03-2020, 12:31 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
johnhicks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Wandering below the Gnat Line
Posts: 1,208
Operating temperature

Let's assume that the MH can't be driven, and it has a mechanical 6BT Cummins. Of course this engine is subject to "old-timey" engine rules and problems.

It's widely said that an idling diesel will never reach "operating temperature" that would drive moisture out of the oil. Can it be reached by fast idle at around 1500rpm or even higher? If so, is there any reason to not do that occasionally?
__________________
-jbh-
johnhicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Join the #1 RV Forum Today - It's Totally Free!

iRV2.com RV Community - Are you about to start a new improvement on your RV or need some help with some maintenance? Do you need advice on what products to buy? Or maybe you can give others some advice? No matter where you fit in you'll find that iRV2 is a great community to join. Best of all it's totally FREE!

You are currently viewing our boards as a guest so you have limited access to our community. Please take the time to register and you will gain a lot of great new features including; the ability to participate in discussions, network with other RV owners, see fewer ads, upload photographs, create an RV blog, send private messages and so much, much more!

Old 12-03-2020, 12:49 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2020
Posts: 1,213
Blog Entries: 1
It needs a load, and you can't generate a load by idling, even a fast idle.
__________________
2006 Damon Daybreak 3276 35'. 3 200 Amp Lithium batteries and 2000 watt Pure wave inverter/charger.
2013 Elantra on a Master Tow dolly.
HarryStone is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2020, 01:07 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 25,572
Heating and letting it cool will create more moisture the just letting it sit, why not leave it off between uses ?
twinboat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2020, 01:18 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 1,512
Both answers are correct.


If you can't drive at least 25 highway miles, don't start the engine.


Equally important while storing is to have a BIOCIDE such as Biobar JF in the fuel tank and tank full to minimize condensation.
__________________
Brett Wolfe
Ex: 2003 Alpine 38FDDS. Ex: 1997 Safari Sahara. Ex: 1993 Foretravel U240
wolfe10 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2020, 01:51 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
Talloaks's Avatar


 
Country Coach Owners Club
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Kalamazoo MI
Posts: 208
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnhicks View Post
Let's assume that the MH can't be driven, and it has a mechanical 6BT Cummins. Of course this engine is subject to "old-timey" engine rules and problems.

It's widely said that an idling diesel will never reach "operating temperature" that would drive moisture out of the oil. Can it be reached by fast idle at around 1500rpm or even higher? If so, is there any reason to not do that occasionally?
Often, what is "widely said" is not as useful as what the manufacturer of the engine says.

Here is a link you can use to find the operating manual for your engine. You will need to enter the ESN. https://www.cummins.com/support/manuals

My CAT C9 engine operating manual warns against excessive idling. It states that if excessive idle time is required, increase and maintain engine RPM above 1000, and ensure engine coolant temperature exceeds 180 degrees F.
__________________
John
2007 Country Coach Tribute; Cat C9 400; 2012 Ford Edge toad; Roadmaster Blackhawk 2 10,000 lb tow bar; Demco AF1 Braking System; 2007 BMW K1200LT Hannigan Trike Conversion; Member, IEEE, NFPA, PMI, NRC SRO (Ret).
Talloaks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2020, 09:06 PM   #6
Senior Member
 
Ray,IN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: North America somewhere
Posts: 21,376
So there you have it JohnHicks; 5 replies and we all agree extended idling is bad for a diesel engine.(Cummins defines extended idling as >10 minutes)
__________________
2000 Winnebago Ultimate Freedom USQ40JD, ISC 8.3 Cummins 350, Spartan MM Chassis. USA IN 1SG 11B5MX,Infantry retired;Good Sam Life member,FMCA." My fellow Americans, ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country. John F. Kennedy
Ray,IN is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2020, 09:39 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Talloaks's Avatar


 
Country Coach Owners Club
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Kalamazoo MI
Posts: 208
OBTW, OP Hicks, thanks for prompting me to learn something new today. I had never heard of the "Gnat Line" until reading it on your post.

But wouldn't it be better to be wandering "above" the gnat line? Just trying to understand.
__________________
John
2007 Country Coach Tribute; Cat C9 400; 2012 Ford Edge toad; Roadmaster Blackhawk 2 10,000 lb tow bar; Demco AF1 Braking System; 2007 BMW K1200LT Hannigan Trike Conversion; Member, IEEE, NFPA, PMI, NRC SRO (Ret).
Talloaks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-03-2020, 09:54 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
johnhicks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Wandering below the Gnat Line
Posts: 1,208
Talloaks, it appears that Cat suggests that fast idle and 180F temp is ok for extended idling. Do you read it the same way? My operating manual just says to avoid excessive idling but the engine doesn't have any way to set fast idle other than hold the pedal down.

Yes, it's lots better to be above the gnat line but I always find myself below it for some reason or other.
__________________
-jbh-
johnhicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2020, 12:23 PM   #9
Senior Member
 
johnhicks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Wandering below the Gnat Line
Posts: 1,208
I did a lot more research and concluded that if idling more than about five minutes fast idle is greatly preferable if not virtually required. I knew that, but what I wanted to dig into was getting moisture out of the oil, and that fast idle will get the temperature up enough to do that plus prevent wet stacking.

Also of note is that low idle causes lots of problems with exhaust systems in modern engines.

So no, I still won't be cranking it up to "exercise" the engine, but if I do need to let it idle more that a few minutes I'll be more careful to keep rpm up.

Thanks to all.
__________________
-jbh-
johnhicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2020, 03:19 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
Talloaks's Avatar


 
Country Coach Owners Club
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Kalamazoo MI
Posts: 208
Quote:
Originally Posted by johnhicks View Post
Talloaks, it appears that Cat suggests that fast idle and 180F temp is ok for extended idling. Do you read it the same way? My operating manual just says to avoid excessive idling but the engine doesn't have any way to set fast idle other than hold the pedal down.
"Avoid excess idling. If the vehicle is parked for more than 5 minutes, stop the engine... Excessive idling can cause carbon buildup and/or excessive idling can cause the engine to slobber. This is harmful to the engine.

If extended idle time is required, control the engine rpm to 1000 rpm or above 1000 rpm. Ensure that the coolant temperature exceeds 82C (180 F). Consult your Caterpillar dealer for assistance."

This is from the Cat Engine Operations manual. It is discouraging idling your engine especially beyond 5 minutes. But...if for some reason you feel you have to... at least run the rpms up and get the coolant temperature up. And, my own editorial comment here, recognize that you are not doing your engine any good in the process.
__________________
John
2007 Country Coach Tribute; Cat C9 400; 2012 Ford Edge toad; Roadmaster Blackhawk 2 10,000 lb tow bar; Demco AF1 Braking System; 2007 BMW K1200LT Hannigan Trike Conversion; Member, IEEE, NFPA, PMI, NRC SRO (Ret).
Talloaks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2020, 03:46 PM   #11
Senior Member
 
Bobby F's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2019
Location: MN
Posts: 1,012
We used to keep magnetic block heaters stuck on the oil pans of old Thiokol snowcats during the offseason storage to drive the moisture out of the oil. That was Thiokol's recommendation. They certainly wouldn't reach operating temps, but we'd leave them on for days at a time, and the heat would eventually vaporize the moisture out. Kept the internal rust away during the summers.
__________________
------------------------------------

1993 Rockwood 28' Class C - Ford E-350 7.5L
Bobby F is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2020, 04:08 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
ArtJoyce's Avatar
 
Monaco Owners Club
Freightliner Owners Club
Holiday Rambler Owners Club
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Ohio
Posts: 298
Quote:
Originally Posted by Talloaks View Post
Often, what is "widely said" is not as useful as what the manufacturer of the engine says.

Here is a link you can use to find the operating manual for your engine. You will need to enter the ESN. https://www.cummins.com/support/manuals

My CAT C9 engine operating manual warns against excessive idling. It states that if excessive idle time is required, increase and maintain engine RPM above 1000, and ensure engine coolant temperature exceeds 180 degrees F.
My cummings also warns about idling. My cummings when parked, if I trun on the cruse controller and hit the set button. It will increase the idling to 1,000 RPM.

Which what I do when getting ready to head out to build up air and warm it up a little for about 10 minutes. Also before shutting down to cool down the top end for a few minutes.
__________________
Art & Joyce
Thornville, OH
Holiday Rambler Endevor
ArtJoyce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2020, 08:05 PM   #13
Senior Member
 
johnhicks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Wandering below the Gnat Line
Posts: 1,208
I do agree that no idling at all is best.

Intersting note about block heaters. I do have a block/oil heater.
__________________
-jbh-
johnhicks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-04-2020, 08:07 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Ray,IN's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: North America somewhere
Posts: 21,376
Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtJoyce View Post
My cummings also warns about idling. My cummings when parked, if I trun on the cruse controller and hit the set button. It will increase the idling to 1,000 RPM.

Which what I do when getting ready to head out to build up air and warm it up a little for about 10 minutes. Also before shutting down to cool down the top end for a few minutes.
A side note; your Cumins manual also says there is no need to cool down their engines unless you have been running hard. The time between exiting an interstate and arriving at the CG is adequate cool down time. Same for warm-up, by the time you reach the interstate the engine is warm enough to run without full-throttle.
__________________
2000 Winnebago Ultimate Freedom USQ40JD, ISC 8.3 Cummins 350, Spartan MM Chassis. USA IN 1SG 11B5MX,Infantry retired;Good Sam Life member,FMCA." My fellow Americans, ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country. John F. Kennedy
Ray,IN is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
temperature



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
norcold operating on back up operating system Raybo RV Systems & Appliances 5 02-17-2013 10:06 PM
Transmission Operating Temperature 2-Nickels Allison Transmission Forum 3 05-18-2012 09:37 PM
C9 Operating Temperature? rickmurph Caterpillar Engine Forum 6 07-04-2011 09:56 AM
Refrigerator Operating Temperature Range Yonderin' New Horizons Owners Forum and NHOG 4 11-10-2010 04:41 AM
Normal operating temperature Wicked Whippets Cummins Engines 10 01-31-2009 04:39 PM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 02:21 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.