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Old 03-26-2023, 09:45 PM   #1
US1
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Overweight with no/light load

2017 F53 24k GVWR chassis.
30,000 lbs GCWR
Frt axle 9000 lbs GAWR
Rear axle 15,500 lbs GAWR
As weighed from factory when new; 21,009 lbs

We loaded up with what we considered necessities for a 4 month stay in a FL. RV park.

Inside items; clothing, food, computer. Being FL, we packed light on the clothing= 1/2 our drawers were empty. Id guess 75#'s of clothing and beauty supplies. Cooking supplies also minimal.

Full LP tank, approx 20 gals of water just for toilet use while traveling. (Fresh water tank located behind front axle) Empty black and grey tanks.

Outside storage compartments also somewhat light; ladder, 4 lawn chairs, grill, table, toolbox (standard plastic toolbox), a couple cases of soda/beer, SP cords, hoses and sewer hoses, misc cans of oil, cleaner, wax and wash items. 2x10s for leveling blocks. Another case of a few empty compartments as I only packed what I deemed needed. No weekend camping items.

Items carried behind the rear axle for a direct impact vs carried by both axles;
2) electric bikes and bike mount @ 210 lbs
1 fullsize mounted 22.5" spare underneath rear frame.
Tow dolly with TOAD adding approx 150-200 tongue weight (Guess)

Filled up 75 gals gas and went over a CAT scale so I can do the tire psi loads:

Ft axle, 7640 lbs
rear axle 16480 lbs (980 lbs over axle rating)
trailer axle 3760 lbs

Month later went over a CAT scale again to double check 1st scale accuracy, Exact same loads as before but without the dolly and TOAD.

Ft axle 7720 lbs
Rear axle 16280 lbs (780 lbs over rating) explains the original tow dolly tongue weight.

Now I can loose the bikes, rack and spare tire, for approx 450
lbs gain, but that still leaves me over the rear axle rating by 300 lbs. I venture to guess the combined weight of everything in my storage bays might be around the 300 lb mark. I dont consider I am carrying alot of weight.

SO, I believe if I had nothing on the hitch and nothing in the storage bays, basically an empty RV except for some food and clothing, 10 gals of water, I MIGHT be right at the limit for my rear axle, although some weight is carried by the front axle.
Any thoughts as I'm at a loss as to why FW would include storage bays and inside closets/drawers, and tanks if they can't be utilized?

Possibly only fix is to install rear springs for a 26K chassis? But I dont see me doing that. And moving heavier items to the front will be a minor gain.

Just venting
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Old 03-27-2023, 07:35 AM   #2
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Tough situation for sure. Hard to tell how much your rear cargo (tow dolly tongue weight, electric bikes & rack and spare tire) are actually influencing your rear axle weight. I would guess, though, that because they are all suspended behind the rear axle, that they are actually influencing that weight by more than their actual weights because they are effectively unloading your front axle. Also, it really sounds like you need to weigh your MH empty (full gas tank only) to see how the front to rear weight distribution is in that state. You may find that the way you are loading your MH is having more influence than you think. Also, just a suggestion, many of us with 22.5 tires do not carry a spare, specifically because of the weight. For sure, you need to figure out how to front load your storage bays as much as possible to move as much weight carrying to your front axle as you can.

One last comment on your statement about the rear springs. Since you already know that the only difference between the 24K and 26K chassis is the deflection rate of the rear leaf springs, another option is to add a single 2000 lb. helper leaf to each rear spring. A good spring shop can do that easily for you at a reasonable cost. It does not change your certified weight rating, but it will give you the means to use more of the rear axle's built in weight carrying capability. I did that on my Open Road knowing full well that all of the other axle components were fully capable of 17,500. I typically carry more weight on my front axle than you seem to, so the heaviest I ever weighed in the rear was 15,620, but I had no qualms with that number because of the addition of the helper springs. The only downside of the helper springs is a somewhat stiffer suspension in the rear, but I had full confidence in being able to carry the additional weight. Only other option is to go the LiquidSpring route, but if you donít want to do leaf springs, you wonít want to do that. Good luck figuring things out.
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Old 03-27-2023, 08:23 AM   #3
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As others have noted, move as much as possible forward. Since the water tank is behind the front axle, you may want to experiment and see what happens if you ADD more water to it. All weight behind the rear axle gets multiplied by its distance from the axle. If you can, try mounting the ebikes on the toad. This could give you back 250-300 lbs.

Although it's nice to have a mounted spare tire, it adds a considerable amount of weight to the rear axle. Again, as others have stated, I never had a spare tire on my 36 foot Class A on the Workhorse 22K chassis. If you feel that you need to have a spare, you could get rid of the wheel part and save some more weight. Roadside assistance can mount a tire in no time.

If your toad has the GVWR capacity, you may want to offload some of the heavier things, like your toolbox into the toad.
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Old 03-27-2023, 08:37 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by US1 View Post
2017 F53 24k GVWR chassis.
30,000 lbs GCWR
Frt axle 9000 lbs GAWR
Rear axle 15,500 lbs GAWR
As weighed from factory when new; 21,009 lbs

We loaded up with what we considered necessities for a 4 month stay in a FL. RV park.

Inside items; clothing, food, computer. Being FL, we packed light on the clothing= 1/2 our drawers were empty. Id guess 75#'s of clothing and beauty supplies. Cooking supplies also minimal.

Full LP tank, approx 20 gals of water just for toilet use while traveling. (Fresh water tank located behind front axle) Empty black and grey tanks.

Outside storage compartments also somewhat light; ladder, 4 lawn chairs, grill, table, toolbox (standard plastic toolbox), a couple cases of soda/beer, SP cords, hoses and sewer hoses, misc cans of oil, cleaner, wax and wash items. 2x10s for leveling blocks. Another case of a few empty compartments as I only packed what I deemed needed. No weekend camping items.

Items carried behind the rear axle for a direct impact vs carried by both axles;
2) electric bikes and bike mount @ 210 lbs
1 fullsize mounted 22.5" spare underneath rear frame.
Tow dolly with TOAD adding approx 150-200 tongue weight (Guess)

Filled up 75 gals gas and went over a CAT scale so I can do the tire psi loads:

Ft axle, 7640 lbs
rear axle 16480 lbs (980 lbs over axle rating)
trailer axle 3760 lbs

Month later went over a CAT scale again to double check 1st scale accuracy, Exact same loads as before but without the dolly and TOAD.

Ft axle 7720 lbs
Rear axle 16280 lbs (780 lbs over rating) explains the original tow dolly tongue weight.

Now I can loose the bikes, rack and spare tire, for approx 450
lbs gain, but that still leaves me over the rear axle rating by 300 lbs. I venture to guess the combined weight of everything in my storage bays might be around the 300 lb mark. I dont consider I am carrying alot of weight.

SO, I believe if I had nothing on the hitch and nothing in the storage bays, basically an empty RV except for some food and clothing, 10 gals of water, I MIGHT be right at the limit for my rear axle, although some weight is carried by the front axle.
Any thoughts as I'm at a loss as to why FW would include storage bays and inside closets/drawers, and tanks if they can't be utilized?

Possibly only fix is to install rear springs for a 26K chassis? But I dont see me doing that. And moving heavier items to the front will be a minor gain.

Just venting
Wow! You certainly, I believe, are overthinking this. Go out and have some fun.

Iím not a mind reader, but if I were, I would guess that I see a larger coach in your future.
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Old 03-27-2023, 09:05 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Country Road View Post
Wow! You certainly, I believe, are overthinking this. Go out and have some fun.

Iím not a mind reader, but if I were, I would guess that I see a larger coach in your future.

LOL, yeah I know I am. Its just been on my mind for the last month while I try to wrap my head around the numbers.I just bought this RV 3 moths ago, so it'll be around for a bit. I traded in a 33' Bounder with a 22K chassis and it was always loaded down and still under the weight limits by a good amount. I go bigger, heavier chassis, 1/2 the normal load......and now this. Go figure.

Doing away with the mounted spare is not an option. I have no desire to wait on the side of the road for several hrs and be charged a small fortune for something I already have and can do myself in less than an hr. I'm the type that does everything myself. Plus just the fact that the tire is throwing me over the limit is mind boggling. I also am aware of the leverage factor the bikes and tire apply more weight to the rear than their actual weight, but there is nothing I can do about that. The bikes are full size. The toad was a 1 time use just to get the car to FL for our stay, then again next month for trip back home, otherwise we never have a toad. We are weekend campers during the summer. The Toad has no hitch, nor is there any made for it, and the bikes wont fit inside it.
I did have the few heavier items toward the front already so very little to gain there. As I tried to stress, we really did not pack heavy, otherwise Id be able to address this issue easily.

Again, more of a venting post. On the positive side, I got my tire PSI requirements now, then the squirrel jumped out.
Thanks
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Old 03-27-2023, 09:12 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike8253 View Post

One last comment on your statement about the rear springs. Since you already know that the only difference between the 24K and 26K chassis is the deflection rate of the rear leaf springs, another option is to add a single 2000 lb. helper leaf to each rear spring. A good spring shop can do that easily for you at a reasonable cost. It does not change your certified weight rating, but it will give you the means to use more of the rear axle's built in weight carrying capability.
Yes, I'm not worried about the rear axle or frame itself for those reasons you stated. Thanks
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Old 03-27-2023, 09:15 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by US1 View Post
2017 F53 24k GVWR chassis.
30,000 lbs GCWR
Frt axle 9000 lbs GAWR
Rear axle 15,500 lbs GAWR
As weighed from factory when new; 21,009 lbs

We loaded up with what we considered necessities for a 4 month stay in a FL. RV park.

Inside items; clothing, food, computer. Being FL, we packed light on the clothing= 1/2 our drawers were empty. Id guess 75#'s of clothing and beauty supplies. Cooking supplies also minimal.

Full LP tank, approx 20 gals of water just for toilet use while traveling. (Fresh water tank located behind front axle) Empty black and grey tanks.

Outside storage compartments also somewhat light; ladder, 4 lawn chairs, grill, table, toolbox (standard plastic toolbox), a couple cases of soda/beer, SP cords, hoses and sewer hoses, misc cans of oil, cleaner, wax and wash items. 2x10s for leveling blocks. Another case of a few empty compartments as I only packed what I deemed needed. No weekend camping items.

Items carried behind the rear axle for a direct impact vs carried by both axles;
2) electric bikes and bike mount @ 210 lbs
1 fullsize mounted 22.5" spare underneath rear frame.
Tow dolly with TOAD adding approx 150-200 tongue weight (Guess)

Filled up 75 gals gas and went over a CAT scale so I can do the tire psi loads:

Ft axle, 7640 lbs
rear axle 16480 lbs (980 lbs over axle rating)
trailer axle 3760 lbs

Month later went over a CAT scale again to double check 1st scale accuracy, Exact same loads as before but without the dolly and TOAD.

Ft axle 7720 lbs
Rear axle 16280 lbs (780 lbs over rating) explains the original tow dolly tongue weight.

Now I can loose the bikes, rack and spare tire, for approx 450
lbs gain, but that still leaves me over the rear axle rating by 300 lbs. I venture to guess the combined weight of everything in my storage bays might be around the 300 lb mark. I dont consider I am carrying alot of weight.

SO, I believe if I had nothing on the hitch and nothing in the storage bays, basically an empty RV except for some food and clothing, 10 gals of water, I MIGHT be right at the limit for my rear axle, although some weight is carried by the front axle.
Any thoughts as I'm at a loss as to why FW would include storage bays and inside closets/drawers, and tanks if they can't be utilized?

Possibly only fix is to install rear springs for a 26K chassis? But I dont see me doing that. And moving heavier items to the front will be a minor gain.

Just venting
If you take the bikes and spare tire off you will gain more than 450 lbs on the rear axle. The cantilever effect moves weight from the front axle to the rear axle.
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:32 AM   #8
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Like many have said, move the bikes. If you can get them on a rack on the toad, it will also give you the ability to go on longer sightseeing trips with the toad and then use the bikes.

Keep the spare tire, but get rid of the rim, unless it's mounted under the coach. If the tire will fit in a bay in front of the rear axle, put it there and then store items inside the tire. Carrying cases of soda, especially if they're closer to the rear axle, downsize and buy the soda at your destination. You can also break down the soda into few cans and store it in small areas left over in the front storage bays.

As noted, moving things forward, even though it may not reduce overall weight, it changes that cantilever effect.
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Old 03-27-2023, 11:32 AM   #9
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Tire weight limits are more important, but for both, just slow down a little.
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Old 03-27-2023, 01:28 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by US1 View Post
... I traded in a 33' Bounder with a 22K chassis and it was always loaded down and still under the weight limits by a good amount. I go bigger, heavier chassis, 1/2 the normal load......and now this. Go figure....

The Bounder must have had a higher wheelbase/length ratio. I have the opposite problem you have. The Tiffin 28DA has an incredibly good W/L ratio and handles great, but the front axle is slightly overweight and the rear axle is 2500 under. I am always trying to move weight to the rear. GVWR 20.5K Front 7K Rear 13.5K
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Old 03-27-2023, 02:04 PM   #11
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Have your wife drive the car down separately and you in the RV or vice versa. Put the bikes on the car along with the spare tire in the trunk.
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Old 03-27-2023, 04:19 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by US1 View Post
Yes, I'm not worried about the rear axle or frame itself for those reasons you stated. Thanks
I'll just reiterate, unless you you were provided the front and rear axle weights as part of the factory weight info you have, you really need to baseline your MH by weighing it empty (no water) with a full tank of gas. Unless you have some idea of what's its empty weight distribution is, you'll just be guessing about the impact of how you are loading it. You have a 24K capable MH as it's configured today and you need to figure out to get within that overall limit, and meet the front and rear limits as well; or, you need to augment the limiting component at the rear to give you some additional capability.
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Old 03-27-2023, 05:57 PM   #13
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People think 3K is a lot of cargo until they actually try it. I have 7.2K payload capacity and I still don't have enough, although almost 2k of that is trailer tongue weight.
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Old 03-28-2023, 08:47 AM   #14
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People think 3K is a lot of cargo until they actually try it. I have 7.2K payload capacity and I still don't have enough, although almost 2k of that is trailer tongue weight.
What kind of trailer and load gives you that much tongue weight? I followed the link and it shows the trailer interior. The inside looks like it is a triple axle.
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