Backing up with toad attached

[MisterT]

A tow dolly is still 4 down, it's problematic, but as noted, still 'doable' if careful. This is one of the drawbacks, though, of dollying when in a situation where unhooking or unloaded is needed.
A Dolly cannot be simply 'removed' or unhooked without first unstrapping, unchaining, and driving off the vehicle... then, physically unattaching and moving the dolly, which is certainly more challenging than unhooking and driving away a 4 down vehicle. Some folks have added a trailer-style fold down roller leg to help detach the dolly without unloading the vehicle, but I'm not sure that's a good everyday answer either, just another option when in a dire situation.

The physics between a dolly and a tow bar in this situation might be slightly different, but both are still problematic, though either are doable if really needed - just be cautious.

[Glenn and Kathy]

I saw a guy make a similar move a FJ in Kingman. He had gassed up and I guess he figured he didn't have room to go forward from the pumps, so he eased back a little. The front wheels of the toad turned, so he pulled forward. He did that a couple of times and then I guess he kinda lost it. Third try he just started backing and the car jack knifed, but he kept going. One side of the car was raised to be almost off the ground, he kept going. When he cleared the gas pumps he put it in drive and took off without even checking for damage. The last I saw of him he was heading up the onramp onto I40.

Glenn

[DGBPokes]

Must have been my brother in law...........But he has a tow dolly. He's a farmer/ rancher, he can drive and back anything, so he says. And then they wonder why something is always bent, broke, or not working.

[twinboat]

Originally Posted by MisterT

A tow dolly is still 4 down, it's problematic, but as noted, still 'doable' if careful. This is one of the drawbacks, though, of dollying when in a situation where unhooking or unloaded is needed.
A Dolly cannot be simply 'removed' or unhooked without first unstrapping, unchaining, and driving off the vehicle... then, physically unattaching and moving the dolly, which is certainly more challenging than unhooking and driving away a 4 down vehicle. Some folks have added a trailer-style fold down roller leg to help detach the dolly without unloading the vehicle, but I'm not sure that's a good everyday answer either, just another option when in a dire situation.

The physics between a dolly and a tow bar in this situation might be slightly different, but both are still problematic, though either are doable if really needed - just be cautious.

Once the car is off the dolly, you can back it up all you want.

You can leave the dolly on the MH. Without a car it's just a short trailer.

[Mr_D]

I backed the CR-V up about 5' two weeks ago. Overshot the dump station. Went very slow watching the monitor the whole time.

[tregal16]

I was always told to never back up with a toad...reason was it would cause damage. I figured they meant the tow bar...so if I understand correctly you CAN back up with toad as long as someone keeps the wheel straight (in the toad) is that correct? It won't harm the tow bar at all?

[hilgert]

You can back up with a towed vehicle. More correctly, you can back up USING the towed vehicle...under specific conditions. I've done this a few times...once by necessity (in my prior little C-MAX towed), and a few times by experiment (using the C-MAX and now the new F-150).

On a FLAT surface with no (or very minimal) turns involved you can use the towed vehicle to pull the motorhome backwards. However, this creates a somewhat reverse (pun intended) set of issues, specifically that the motorhome wheels will turn in undesirable directions, and the motorhome rear end will pull the towed vehicle front wheels in undesirable directions. The one time I had to do this (and I should have really just unhooked) I sat in the C-MAX towed vehicle with my wife in the motorhome, both of us on speakerphones. I *slowly* reversed the towed vehicle, and as the motorhome rear end pulled the towed wheels in an undesired direction I would have my wife apply *small* steering corrections under my command. I never fought the towed wheels...I let the wife's corrections to the motorhome actually do all the turning/corrections...my role was to keep the towed wheel in the correct position, monitor the current status and issue commands to the wife for corrections. Small corrections on the motorhome wheels make large changes on the towed vehicle wheels.

The key is *go very slow* and *have clear communication*. We actually needed to made a slight arc during this one-time event (about 100 feet in total distance pulled), but at the end both steering wheels were in a static position and I could have [slowly] gone another 100 feet. Interestingly, the C-MAX (a hybrid) uses only electric power in reverse, but had no issues. On a flat surface it does not take that much force to pull a lot of weight...most of us have seen the commercial where the pickup pulls the commercial jet.

It's actually not that hard to do once it's been practiced a few times, but I'm certainly more a fan of disconnecting each time instead unless conditions are ideal for backing up (like totally straight back with no incline, turns, etc.). However, this is all about understanding the forces involved, and as long as you go very, very slow, and have really, really good communications with the other driver, it can be done in a pinch.

[Waiter21]

It won't harm the tow bar at all?

Compression mode. When I'm cruising down the road and step on the brakes, , the toad is now pushing on the bar. The stresses on the bar are now in compression mode.

When I put the MH in reverse and back up, The stresses on the bar are once again in compression mode.

WARNING - As the OP witnessed, when backing a toad, the driver MUST be aware of whats going on with the toad. This is a new skill that must be practiced. If you weigh the risks and don't want to attempt it, then there is an option to disconnect. If you mitigate the risks and have practiced the maneuver, put it in "R" and go.

[hilgert]

I should also add (to my prior post) that the real pain (albeit not huge) is disconnecting and reconnecting the supplemental braking system, etc...that takes more time than the actual backing up event itself.

[twinboat]

The last post mentions supplemental braking.

Having toad brakes takes the compression forces, ( that was mentioned in the post before that ), off of the tow bar when stopping.

Do the tow bar manufactures recommend using supplemental braking ?

[hilgert]

Originally Posted by twinboat

Do the tow bar manufactures recommend using supplemental braking ?

Supplemental braking, with breakaway, is the law in the US (I think there is one state that is an exception) and Canada. This protects other drivers from a breakaway situation, and protects you from a lawsuit. Also, a supplemental brake system reduces the load on the motorhome brakes, especially when travelling in hilly areas or when coming to quick stops. Unless your motorhome *vastly* exceeds the weight of your towed vehicle, the motorhome brakes will get a good workout without a supplemental brake system on the towed.

[THenman]

I have backed up once with toad. Over shot DEF fill after getting desiel. I was going straight a good ways before getting desiel and still straight when I overshot my DEF fill. Only had to back a few feet but watched very carefully how toad was moving and went very slow JIC toad started to turn.

As to compression on tow bar it happens when driving. Like if my compression brake is active I am not sending air to make toad brakes work. In that case coach through tow bar is slowing toad. So even with braking system it is possible. Also with this system it is very quick to hook/unhook just one air line with quick disconnects and one breakaway line with clips.

Tom