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Hikerdogs · 09-05-2015, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by OLYLEN

Just a comment here. Years ago in the olden days, say 1962 before all the rules and regulations, dad purchased a Chev 1/2 ton pickup put overloads on and a good sized slide in camper, put the boat behind it maybe 6000# on a bumper ball hitch and we towed it all over mountains desert what ever no problem. But that was before anyone KNEW better. All kinds of people were doing the same, no problem. JMT

LEN

That was in a time when radiators, transmission coolers, differentials, brakes, and all other components weren't matched by computer for the size and weight the vehicle was expected to carry. Almost all systems were oversized. Todays components are sized to take only marginally larger loads than they are rated for.

Case and point are the brakes on the F53 chassis. Ford says they are rated for the GVWR not the GCWR. They go so far as to say anything being towed that weighs over 1,500 lbs. needs it's own braking system.

When Workhorse was still in the business they said anything towed weighing over 1,000 lbs. needs it's own braking system.

Quincybear · 09-06-2015, 10:17 AM

Thanks to everyone on your input, very informative. I ended up shipping the car with a shipping company just fyi. I appreciated the different points of view.

Hikerdogs · 09-06-2015, 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bucky1320

My experience is that they often put the hitch on there that is the cheapest. A friend has a DP with lots of available towing capacity. He figures he is great to go pulling his trailer with that capacity. A year or two later the hitch breaks! No incident, but frightening to think of. He investigates the hitch.....5000 lbs. He could find no aftermarket hitch that would fit his pusher that was rated for what the coach would pull. So he reinforced it. Big time! What choices did he have?
My DP came with a hitch with NO rating sticker on it. None. One look at it told me it was not worthy of pulling 10k lbs though. And I am indeed a degreed mechanical engineer with years of design experience as well as fabrication experience. The hitch has since been reinforced.

My professional opinion is that if something is going to fail as you are pulling, you DON'T want it to be the hitch. Let it be the trans or an axle bearing or ANYTHING but the hitch. Have a competent fabricator add strength to it and don't second guess the decision. Or take the path of no risk and don't leave the house.

Since at least 2012 Winnebago has been manufacturing and installing their own hitches. Wen I asked a company rep Why?, his response was that they didn't feel the hitches currently available on the market were strong enough for their applications. He also mentioned the Winnebago design was 50% stronger than the ones they had been purchasing. He didn't say if the commercial hitches were over rated for what they could actually pull or carry. He just said they were no longer satisfactory for their applications.

Frutza · 09-06-2015, 11:48 PM

can you tow more than your rating? Shure you can, the problem comes in if there is a problem, an accident, if you knowingly exceed the limits of your vehicle, and you get into an accident and they can prove negligence on your part, you've bought it. you may be able to tow it just fine, but can you stop it? If you get into an accident and your negligent and they have a good lawyer, will your insurance company stand behind you?
But people put lots of miles towing over weight with out ant issues, so , do you feel lucky?

wa8yxm · 09-07-2015, 08:27 AM

Mike I'm fond of using that point when it comes to brakes on the towed.. If you rear end me and you don't have them.... GOOD LUCK cause I know the physics and you can bet my lawyers will too.. and it will be expensive.

Frutza · 09-08-2015, 11:52 AM

But with that being said, why don't they give us credit for having trailer brakes? I read the thread on braking power, Bph?, were as six tires on the ground will give you x amount of stopping power, I get that.

So I pull a little over weight, but most of my extra weight is right on the hitch, so, I look for a #10000 hitch, Freightliner says the rear of the coach can handle #10000, the Gvw does not have #10000 to spare, so I look for a #10000 hitch, and weight distributing hitch, so I get my #10000 hitch, and low and behold its the same dam hitch I have with a different weight on the sticker.

So we worry about doing the right thing when they just play with the numbers.

Just venting frustration,
wa9yxm, I'll try to keep you in the mirror, so I don't rear end you

Gordon Dewald · 09-09-2015, 04:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frutza

But with that being said, why don't they give us credit for having trailer brakes? I read the thread on braking power, Bph?, were as six tires on the ground will give you x amount of stopping power, I get that.

So I pull a little over weight, but most of my extra weight is right on the hitch, so, I look for a #10000 hitch, Freightliner says the rear of the coach can handle #10000, the Gvw does not have #10000 to spare, so I look for a #10000 hitch, and weight distributing hitch, so I get my #10000 hitch, and low and behold its the same dam hitch I have with a different weight on the sticker.

So we worry about doing the right thing when they just play with the numbers.

Just venting frustration,
wa9yxm, I'll try to keep you in the mirror, so I don't rear end you

I expect if you read all of the literature there will be some place where they state that after a certain weight auxiliary brakes are required.

I am confused by the GVW will not accept 10,000 lbs. Perhaps you mean the GCVW. The weight on the hitch is all that is added to the GVWR.

Bucky1320 · 09-10-2015, 05:56 AM

IMO, stopping shouldn't really be an issue regardless of the weight you are pulling. You set the trailer brakes up properly, and there should be no more stress on the coach's braking system than there is without the trailer. You know how it feels when I am stopping with the 9,000 lb trailer behind me? Exactly like it does without the trailer.

Lambob · 09-14-2015, 12:27 PM

My 2014 ACE 30.1 has a GVWR of 18,000 lbs. The CGVWR is 23,000 lbs. My toad hitch is rated for 8,000 lbs and the ACE towing capacity is 5,000 lbs.

I took my ACE to have it weighed with a full tank of fuel and full capacity fresh water (I normally don't travel with any water). I didn't take my DW but she only weighs about 125 lbs. It weighed 16,200 lbs with everything I normally take with me to camp (including my svelte 210 lb body).

I then drove back to the scales with my 2014 GMC Acadia and had it weighed with a full tank of gas and my towing gear in place (however, without the toad hitch). It weighed a little less than 5,200 lbs. If you subtract my 210 lbs it comes to 4,990 lbs towable weight with a full tank of gas. I will only tow the Acadia with about 1/4 tank of fuel which should reduce the weight even more.

I have been reviewing this site after buying my ACE and the one thing I learned is the importance of actually weighing your vehicles. The Acadia website indicated that the maximum weight for my Acadia with driver and full tank of gas was 4,850 lbs. That is obviously not correct!

I have a RV1brake2 as an auxiliary braking system. Even though I am pushing my ACE's 5,00lb towing capacity, will I be safe to tow with this setup?

Hikerdogs · 09-14-2015, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lambob

My 2014 ACE 30.1 has a GVWR of 18,000 lbs. The CGVWR is 23,000 lbs. My toad hitch is rated for 8,000 lbs and the ACE towing capacity is 5,000 lbs.

I took my ACE to have it weighed with a full tank of fuel and full capacity fresh water (I normally don't travel with any water). I didn't take my DW but she only weighs about 125 lbs. It weighed 16,200 lbs with everything I normally take with me to camp (including my svelte 210 lb body).

I then drove back to the scales with my 2014 GMC Acadia and had it weighed with a full tank of gas and my towing gear in place (however, without the toad hitch). It weighed a little less than 5,200 lbs. If you subtract my 210 lbs it comes to 4,990 lbs towable weight with a full tank of gas. I will only tow the Acadia with about 1/4 tank of fuel which should reduce the weight even more.

I have been reviewing this site after buying my ACE and the one thing I learned is the importance of actually weighing your vehicles. The Acadia website indicated that the maximum weight for my Acadia with driver and full tank of gas was 4,850 lbs. That is obviously not correct!

I have a RV1brake2 as an auxiliary braking system. Even though I am pushing my ACE's 5,00lb towing capacity, will I be safe to tow with this setup?

In most cases the "published" weight is a bare bones model. Any accessories ordered by you or the dealer aren't included. Accessories could include such mundane things as different wheels and tires, a third seat, rear AC and a dozen other things that are ordered on every vehicle. The manufacturers regularly run "specials" that include option packages not found on the bare bones models. I'll bet 90+% of the cars on the road have one or more "options" that bring the actual weight above the published weight.

If you notice the Winnebago website it also gives height measurements. The little asterisk at the end of the sentence gives the caveat that the published height is to the tallest standard feature on the motorhome. So if you order a satellite dish the "published" height doesn't apply.

ChasA · 09-14-2015, 04:49 PM

I'd say you're okay to tow the Acadia so long as you don't use it to carry a bunch of other stuff.

Gordon Dewald · 09-14-2015, 11:01 PM

GCWR = 23,000 lbs
Loaded = 16,325

You can tow 6,675 lbs without exceeding the GCWR.

I assume you mean by towing capacity the hitch is rated for 5,000 lbs. If that is the case then that is your limiting factor.

The weight of your toad at 4990 is within the limits of the hitch capacity so you should be fine towing with the current hitch.

Lambob · 09-15-2015, 10:33 AM

Chase A and Gordon -

As I understand your responses I could technically haul another 10 lbs in my Acadia and an additional 1,675 lbs (assuming my wife is with me) in my ACE without exceeding the GVWR of the MH, GCWR of MH and Acadia, or 5,000 tow rating of my MH.

By the way, my hitch is rated for 8,000 lbs but the MH is only rated to tow 5,000 lbs.

Thanks for the help!

Gordon Dewald · 09-16-2015, 09:10 AM

Looking at your numbers I come to the following conclusion. Based on your GVWR of 18,000 and GCWR of 23,000 the manufacturer has stated that the towing is 5,000. So a fully loaded MH can tow 5,000.

My understanding is that weight not used in the GVWR can be applied to the tow weight so 23,000 -16,325 = 6325. (Note: you cannot apply the rule in reverse and add weight no used in the tow to exceed the GVWR).

Based on the numbers and the capacity of the hitch (which I assume was factory installed) I believe you are well within capacity.