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Bobby F · 01-02-2020, 05:18 PM

To put all of this in context for people (like me) who have little practical experience with EV's:

In a park in which electric is metered and charged to the renter, how much would it cost to plug in and fully charge a typical (is there such a thing?) EV that was almost completely dead on arrival?

Are we talking $10 or $100?

jcussen · 01-02-2020, 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby F

To put all of this in context for people (like me) who have little practical experience with EV's:

In a park in which electric is metered and charged to the renter, how much would it cost to plug in and fully charge a typical (is there such a thing?) EV that was almost completely dead on arrival?

Are we talking $10 or $100?

In the case of a Tesla, you get about 4 miles for every kilowatt. So if you need to recharge for 200 miles, you will need 50 kilowatts.
The park can charge what they want per kw. but at 25 cents a kw, about $12.50. But depends where the park is. Down where I live, sometimes less the 15 cents per kw, and at the house about 10 cents.

redcolorado · 01-02-2020, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby F

To put all of this in context for people (like me) who have little practical experience with EV's:

In a park in which electric is metered and charged to the renter, how much would it cost to plug in and fully charge a typical (is there such a thing?) EV that was almost completely dead on arrival?

Are we talking $10 or $100?

It depends on the electric rate. If my Tesla Model S was fully discharged and the electric rate was 10 cents per kilowatt hour it would cost $10.

clifford j · 01-02-2020, 06:12 PM

For those who tow EV's and have a rig with a generator, you can charge your own EV battery , yes ?

CLIFFORD

RVPioneer · 01-02-2020, 06:16 PM

The previously mentioned C-max has an 8kW battery. A full charge would probably consume 6.5-7.0kW’s. Similar to charging a 600ah bank of house batteries on a Class A, for example. Or running a 1500w portable heater for 4 hours. At 20 cents/kWh the cost would be less than $1.50.

RVPioneer · 01-02-2020, 06:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clifford j

For those who tow EV's and have a rig with a generator, you can charge your own EV battery , yes ?

CLIFFORD

I own a Plug-in Hybrid EV but don’t tow it. You could charge from a generator, although it wouldn’t be very efficient. My Onan diesel uses 1/2 gal/hr at half load. Using a Level 1 charger, which is 12A at 120v, I would gain ~8 miles of EV range per gallon of diesel, and everyone would have to breathe the exhaust.

My car, a Honda Clarity, has the ability to charge its own batteries while driving with the ICE in, what is called HV charge mode. The ICE actually powers a DC generator. Surprisingly, fuel economy does not decline significantly when doing this. It will charge a fully depleted battery up to 60% SOC in less than 1 hour. This adds ~30 miles of EV range back to the battery.

jcussen · 01-02-2020, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clifford j

For those who tow EV's and have a rig with a generator, you can charge your own EV battery , yes ?

CLIFFORD

Yes, but a 10 kw gen fully loaded is only 10 kw. So in theory, charging 50 kw would take you 5 hours. If you are running ac's maybe 5 kw, so 10 hours. This is assuming you can get 240 volts off your generator.

BillJinOR · 01-02-2020, 07:26 PM

Electric car use is new enough I don’t think rules have been thought out. My volt with empty battery can load 14 kw .. about a buck 40 to two bucks .. that gets me 50 miles. Not a big part of my 40 plus bucks nightly fee but....
I have used it as my full time toad for 21/2 years. Pulled on a American tow dolly . To answer the steering question , since the American has a turntable platform , I use the seat belt thru the bottom of the steering wheel to keep the wheel in check. Actually unless you do a sharp turn even that wouldn’t be needed.

I can only give my experience... I charge our volt via campground power included or paid for by the KW . Owners / Managers have seen it and I have never been questioned negatively. In fact I have been asked many many questions by mgmt and people interested in buying electric. The volt , no longer made , is a full time electric car with a on board generator that adds 350 miles at 42mpg on gas. Not the best hybrid mileage nor the best electric , due to carrying around a 1400cu generator and a larger battery pack than a hybrid. I have Absolutely no range anxiety. As it will drive forever on gas for longer trips
Say what you will , Every electric driver I have met won’t go back willingly to ICE ...power ,acceleration , quiet and much more. Campgrounds will need to decide how to handle this in the future ... for now it is what it is.

Bobby F · 01-02-2020, 07:34 PM

So we're talking about $10 for the highest capacity EV's.

And if the CG's decide to simply drop that into overhead, it might raise everyone's rate by $1. Probably less, since EV's don't accompany 10% of campers.

More likely, if a CG has business sense, they'll see the growing trend as an opportunity, and you'll see paid charging stations popping up, and restrictions on charging outside of those stations.

This is all happening at the very start of a trend, in which the market hasn't yet hit on a way to capture the correct revenue from the situation. This stage never lasts long.

If people want to worry about fairness, talk instead about the rather large tax incentives being given to relatively rich EV buyers.

radar · 01-02-2020, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby F

So we're talking about $10 for the highest capacity EV's.

And if the CG's decide to simply drop that into overhead, it might raise everyone's rate by $1. Probably less, since EV's don't accompany 10% of campers.

More likely, if a CG has business sense, they'll see the growing trend as an opportunity, and you'll see paid charging stations popping up, and restrictions on charging outside of those stations.

This is all happening at the very start of a trend, in which the market hasn't yet hit on a way to capture the correct revenue from the situation. This stage never lasts long.

If people want to worry about fairness, talk instead about the rather large tax incentives being given to relatively rich EV buyers.

Trucks will have bigger batteries. 200 kWh ish. So if they arrived empty and power was 20 cents a kWh you would be looking at 40 bucks. A separate metered 240 connection would work well. The EV driver could use their own EVSE. No hardware required. We use our own EVSE unless we are at a commercial charger. It will be phased in slow. Do 10 sites first. A few years later do 10 more etc.

jcussen · 01-02-2020, 07:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bobby F

So we're talking about $10 for the highest capacity EV's.

And if the CG's decide to simply drop that into overhead, it might raise everyone's rate by $1. Probably less, since EV's don't accompany 10% of campers.

More likely, if a CG has business sense, they'll see the growing trend as an opportunity, and you'll see paid charging stations popping up, and restrictions on charging outside of those stations.

This is all happening at the very start of a trend, in which the market hasn't yet hit on a way to capture the correct revenue from the situation. This stage never lasts long.

If people want to worry about fairness, talk instead about the rather large tax incentives being given to relatively rich EV buyers.

No tax incentives for Tesla anymore.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/micr...x-credit-tesla

Trapper2022 · 01-02-2020, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jcussen

In the case of a Tesla, you get about 4 miles for every kilowatt. So if you need to recharge for 200 miles, you will need 50 kilowatts.
The park can charge what they want per kw. but at 25 cents a kw, about $12.50. But depends where the park is. Down where I live, sometimes less the 15 cents per kw, and at the house about 10 cents.

Parks can not charge what every they want in all states. To raise the rate charged from an electric company to your business you need a license to be a reseller. What this means in TX is that parks can only charge you the rate they pay for electric. Not to many have reseller license.

As far as charging at parks in my years full timing I only met one person that had a Chevy volt as their tow. No charges since they stayed monthly and paid for all electric used. Point is not many EV being used as tow. Adding the hassle of a trailer or dollie is not what most people are looking for. I look forward to the day they make an EV that can be towed four down. Think I may be dead before ir happens.

Enjoy the journey

RVPioneer · 01-02-2020, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by radar

Trucks will have bigger batteries. 200 kWh ish. So if they arrived empty and power was 20 cents a kWh you would be looking at 40 bucks. A separate metered 240 connection would work well. The EV driver could use their own EVSE. No hardware required. We use our own EVSE unless we are at a commercial charger. It will be phased in slow. Do 10 sites first. A few years later do 10 more etc.

It’ll be interesting to see how many of those EV trucks actually make it to the campground with a 10,000lb trailer in tow.

Bobby F · 01-02-2020, 08:51 PM

"Parks can not charge what every they want in all states."

True. I was envisioning more of a situation where established resellers go to CG locations and offer to install their own equipment and handle all details while paying the CG a fee.

My understanding is that those guys can charge whatever the market will bear. It won't be an outrageous kW fee - it'll be a normal kW fee plus a facility fee.

"Trucks will have bigger batteries."

I'm no big fan of the current EV situation for various reasons, but you do touch on the one great thing about it - as an RV'er, I'll be one of the first large beneficiaries of the progress they've forced in battery development. Every dollar that someone puts into developing better truck batteries is going to eventually benefit me. So, just for that, Yay, EV's!