Community Forums

rpasetto · 06-26-2018, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bumps

Jim:

Same experience for me: 2015 with no wobble history and then a high speed event (60mph) that scared the living daylights out of us. Then we got the notice from FCA about the harness mod.

Three differences in our experience:
1. We did not have very many miles on the 2015 Cherokee (TrailHawk) at the time (25,500 if my records are correct).
2. The wobble did not go away after we had the harness installed by Jeep.
3. It is my opinion that the violence of the "high speed event" damaged the structure of the Jeep chassis such that it cannot be towed safely 4-wheels down any more, regardless of harness mod.

To Jeep's shame, we now ride the Jeep on a trailer that we pull behind the MH. To no surprise, we have not had any wobble events ever since we started towing the Jeep on a trailer!

\ken

I agree with @BobGed here. The test to see if the harness does activate the EPS will tell us all a lot. There've been other KL owners who reported wobble after harness installation and this test revealed there was a flaw in harness or install.

However, since you had one of the rarer High-speed wobble events, there may be damage to front end or even other components. It may be well worthwhile to have you KL thoroughly checked out by an independent alignment shop... and that should be on Jeep's dime.

Safe travels.

flywithcoop · 06-28-2018, 06:34 PM

Being a 2018 Trailhawk owner I follow this thread religiously. It appears the most problems have been occurring with 2015 models. I had to wait for my flat tow harness because Jeep was performing a modification to the harness. I suspect that owners with a Cherokee older then 2018 may need a new modified harness. My harness came with a relay installed which basically controls the power to the EPS system. Some people have said they have no relay. Is this the 2018 change to the Harness? Just towed my 2018 cross country with NO problems. Fingers crossed.

dpinvidic · 06-29-2018, 07:52 AM

I purchased a tow cable for my 2014 when it was new. It also has the relay. The relay is taped inside the cable some people may not know it actually exists.

Dan

rpasetto · 06-29-2018, 02:52 PM

Yep, relay is there in my '15

opbart1 · 06-29-2018, 03:32 PM

Thought I would throw out my experience again as this is again being discussed. My 2014 Cherokee Limited has the harness installed and was still experiencing the wobble. Dealer went through everything again and verified install but eps was not powering at when set to tow. Finally determined the main power connection at the battery terminal was insufficient and would not provide enough draw. Have replaced connectors and problem went away. No wobble since.

Bumps · 06-30-2018, 06:59 PM

Quote:

...However, since you had one of the rarer High-speed wobble events, there may be damage to front end or even other components. It may be well worthwhile to have you KL thoroughly checked out by an independent alignment shop...

1. Yes, the harness appears to be working fine.

2. Yes, there is wobble damage to the Jeep. Underneath it is on both left and right sides. On top, the hood and quarter panels no longer align. I have had a couple of people look at the frame pieces and they say it can prolly be fixed, but they aren't willing to do it for fear of liability down-the-road.

Jeep's expert looked at it and concluded that the damage was because I had hooked up the tow bar incorrectly. I was not allowed to talk to him person-to-person or demonstrate how a tow bar attaches the MH to the Jeep. I guess he may think that I inadvertently installed the tow bar upside down that day?

\ken

rpasetto · 07-01-2018, 03:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bumps

1. Yes, the harness appears to be working fine.

2. Yes, there is wobble damage to the Jeep. Underneath it is on both left and right sides. On top, the hood and quarter panels no longer align. I have had a couple of people look at the frame pieces and they say it can prolly be fixed, but they aren't willing to do it for fear of liability down-the-road.

Jeep's expert looked at it and concluded that the damage was because I had hooked up the tow bar incorrectly. I was not allowed to talk to him person-to-person or demonstrate how a tow bar attaches the MH to the Jeep. I guess he may think that I inadvertently installed the tow bar upside down that day?

\ken

Those pictures clearly show damage; there are clearly broken welds. Not sure what component that is in the pictures, but I'd be reluctant to drive it like that. Just because one 'Jeep expert' put the blame on you is not reason to give up.

Bikinjim · 07-01-2018, 05:05 AM

The damage to the aluminum frame members may not be wobble induced. I had the same type of damage to my Trailhawk due to a badly designed Blue Ox baseplate and I know of several others with the same baseplate (BX1136 version 0) that also had the same damage. Blue Ox revised their design which prevents this damage but to my knowledge never recalled the ones that remained in the field. In my case, I had the aluminum beams rewelded and also the lower radiator support cross beam rewelded that had developed cracks. My story is provided in the link below:

http://www.irv2.com/forums/f85/2015-...te-359284.html

rpasetto · 07-01-2018, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bikinjim

The damage to the aluminum frame members may not be wobble induced. I had the same type of damage to my Trailhawk due to a badly designed Blue Ox baseplate and I know of several others with the same baseplate (BX1136 version 0) that also had the same damage. Blue Ox revised their design which prevents this damage but to my knowledge never recalled the ones that remained in the field. In my case, I had the aluminum beams rewelded and also the lower radiator support cross beam rewelded that had developed cracks. My story is provided in the link below:

http://www.irv2.com/forums/f85/2015-...te-359284.html

Each time I go thru equipping a new toad I read thru the install instructions of all 3 baseplate mfgrs and every spec I can... When I did this for the Cherokee, there was something, I do not recall what, which caused me to chose another.

LarryinID · 07-02-2018, 01:00 PM

To the skeptics about the 2019 Cherokee actually fixing the problem without needing the flat tow harness: there is now plenty of confirming evidence. There is both a FCA announcement and service advisory. Both the updated 2019 online Owners Manual and Users Guide have tables that delete the tow harness and need to charge the battery while towing. And Jeep Cares responded to my inquiry confirming it is a real change. (Alas, so far they haven’t been able to describe the design change. I have reason to believe it must be mechanical (e.g. damper) vs. software as some have opined.)

That said, my clueless dealer installed it on my 2019 Trailhawk as part of my purchase deal. I haven’t got to try it yet as Demco still hasn’t offered baseplate.

My question to the knowledgable here: do you think it will be OK to just never put in the fuse and flip the switch, or should I insist they remove it?

rpasetto · 07-02-2018, 01:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LarryinID

To the skeptics about the 2019 Cherokee actually fixing the problem without needing the flat tow harness: there is now plenty of confirming evidence. There is both a FCA announcement and service advisory. Both the updated 2019 online Owners Manual and Users Guide have tables that delete the tow harness and need to charge the battery while towing. And Jeep Cares responded to my inquiry confirming it is a real change. (Alas, so far they haven’t been able to describe the design change. I have reason to believe it must be mechanical (e.g. damper) vs. software as some have opined.)

That said, my clueless dealer installed it on my 2019 Trailhawk as part of my purchase deal. I haven’t got to try it yet as Demco still hasn’t offered baseplate.

My question to the knowledgable here: do you think it will be OK to just never put in the fuse and flip the switch, or should I insist they remove it?

Larry, Based on the detail of how the "flat-tow-harness" is designed and works which was initially posted back in '15 or '16 by Array, I'd say it'd be OK to leave it in... provided no errors were made when the dealer installed it that is.

The fuse just applies power to a relay which energizes the EPS; you could even remove the relay (keep it as a spare). The in-console switch disconnects the EPS from the CAN bus so leaving it in the "normal" down position should not have an effect, just don't flip it up to the "tow" position. [This part is a "bear" to remove from the system since there are a lot of (breakable) plastic pieces.]

Yep. I was certainly one of the skeptics... after all in 2018 it wasn't until mid model year that the TSB adding the model year to the "f-t-h" list, with lots of sales made since the prior summer. Same for the 2017 MY.

The TSB to which you refer, excludes the 2019 Cherokee from the same "flat-tow-harness" list; conspicuous by it's absence is any statement about solving the wobble issue for the '19 KL. That wording being used is quite similar to that used a year or so ago after it had been incorrectly announced that the 'flat-tow-harness" and FCA announced the TSB did not apply to 2016-2017 "wobbling" Grand Cherokee.

So when all the evidence is in, I will gladly retract my skepticism. Meanwhile owners of 2016+ GCs continue to await a solution ... and I heard something about the new Wrangler.

So good luck and safe travels; while I remain a skeptic I also hope I am wrong, for the sake of y'all with '19's.

DamonDude · 10-19-2018, 10:29 AM

I'm getting ready to install the automatic version of the flat tow harness in my 2014 Cherokee. I'm also going to have to install a brake light relay so my supplemental braking system won't override the signal coming from the motorhome. Plus, I'll need to charge the Cherokee's battery from the 12V Charge Line. I haven't seen anyone depict the integration of all three things in a diagram so I took a shot starting with Dan's now famous block diagram.

The way it is currently depicted I'd run separate 12V leads thru the firewall - one for the brake relay and one for the relay that replaces the switch. Is that unnecessary duplication or could I run one wire to feed both?

Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

dpinvidic · 10-20-2018, 08:23 AM

For the toad brake/turn/tail lights, it is better to install two relays (one behind each brake light assembly) so that the turn signals will flash while you are stopped.

You can run the same 12V wire which comes from the 10A fuse to the back of the toad to control the coils for both relays.
Basically the rear relays will select which input is used for the bake light LED (high brightness).

Also run the Left & Right Turn signal wires from your trailer connector to the back of the car.
Unplug the tail light assembly and identify the wire that is the Brake/Turn wire.
Cut this wire, and insert the relay such that the "Normally Closed" contacts restore this connection. "Com" goes to LED, N.C. goes to the jeep side of the cut wire. When the relays are not energized, the car works normally.

Connect the Motorhome turn signals to the N.O.. Now when the 12v line from the RV is hot, the flat tow harness is energized, and the relays for the brake lights have switched so the RV controls the Jeep Brake/Turn lights.

The running lights are connected as normal to the "Tail Light" wire at the rear.

Hope this makes sense....if you like I can generate a schematic for you.

Dan

DamonDude · 10-20-2018, 04:51 PM

Dan,

I was planning on using the Hopkins wiring kit (HM56208) to make the tail light wiring simple. No cutting involved. It contains a diode but not the relay you described. That will allow the MH to activate the brake/turn lights on the Cherokee. In order to keep things simple would the Roadmaster Brake Lite Relay be the best option just to keep the supplemental brake system (probably an RVIBrake3) from activating the brake lights?

Dave