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View Poll Results: Vote On Accuracy Of Thor Brochure For 8,000-lb Hitch
Vote Yes If You Agree Thor Advertising Was Complete and Accurate 1 12.50%
Vote No If You Agree That The Thor Advertising Was Not Complete and Accurate 5 62.50%
Vote This Option If You Have No Opinion 2 25.00%
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Old 05-23-2018, 12:45 PM   #99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mich F View Post
What are you towing with ?
Thanks for the reply.
The tow vehicle is all Thor Class C Motorhomes with an 8,000# hitch and 500# tongue limit.

Standard rule of thumb for towing is tongue weight is generally 10-15% of towing capacity. Also Capacity & tongue increases with a weight distributing hitch.

To set Safe Towing capacity for any vehicle you have to consider other components such as engine, tranny, brakes, suspension, Frame, etc...

To have a tow vehicle with a 8,000# capacity and a 500# tongue weight there has to be a component of the tow vehicle that limits the tongue weight to 500#'s.
Is it the suspension, or the Frame? or am I missing something.
This vehicle could not use a weight distributing hitch without addressing the component that limits the tongue weight to 500#'s
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Old 05-23-2018, 01:21 PM   #100
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I don't believe they are talking about an 8,000# trailer with a 500# tongue weight. Those are just two separate limits. You would have about a 6% tongue weight and that trailer would be all over the road. They are saying the hitch is rated for 8,000#, (even though Ford only has a 7,500# difference between GVWR and GCWR on the E450s).They also limit the tongue weight to 500#, which has probably more to do with the distance between the rear axle and hitch on many RVs which would add considerably more weight on the rear axle than the 500# at the hitch, than any shortcomings in the hitch or frame.

If you were towing a heavier toad four down or even on a dolly the tongue weight would obviously not be an issue.
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Old 05-24-2018, 06:17 AM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bry899 View Post
Thanks for the reply.
To have a tow vehicle with a 8,000# capacity and a 500# tongue weight there has to be a component of the tow vehicle that limits the tongue weight to 500#'s.
Is it the suspension, or the Frame? or am I missing something
Is the vehicle in question a MH with a longer OAL than the Van it is based on? If so, then the frame extension might be the weak link. And a 500 Lb TW on a ball 8 feet behind the axle is going to add a whole lot more weight to the rear axle than the same 500 Lbs 2 ft behind. And make the front axle lighter too...
BTW, my post was not to tell anybody what the can pull, but comparing the "deception" the OP was complaining about to the "deception" industry wide when advertising Tow Capacity. I think most understand, if they want maximum tow capacity they must have the right power train, brake, and suspension set-up. What is less well understood is that they can't have all the fancy power and comfort stuff most think they must have in their car...
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Old 05-24-2018, 08:48 PM   #102
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Originally Posted by ScoobyDoo View Post
Is the vehicle in question a MH with a longer OAL than the Van it is based on? If so, then the frame extension might be the weak link. And a 500 Lb TW on a ball 8 feet behind the axle is going to add a whole lot more weight to the rear axle than the same 500 Lbs 2 ft behind. And make the front axle lighter too...
BTW, my post was not to tell anybody what the can pull, but comparing the "deception" the OP was complaining about to the "deception" industry wide when advertising Tow Capacity. I think most understand, if they want maximum tow capacity they must have the right power train, brake, and suspension set-up. What is less well understood is that they can't have all the fancy power and comfort stuff most think they must have in their car...
I understand the weight limits and there are a lot of people that will exceed them.
The deception is an issue, even some of the replies on this thread about adding a weight distributing hitch to add more towing ability is scary.

These motorhomes are not designed to be used with a weight distributing hitch, but a few people will eventually use them.
And there are plenty of shops that will also sell them.

The OP claimed it is a weak frame extension and I believe he might be right.
I compared all the Thor class C Four winds motorhomes with towing 8000#/500#TW's .
The distance from rear axle to back of unit varies from 130" to 163" or almost 3 feet, with the same drive train.

What happens when that sticker fades or falls off the hitch and the unit is sold to someone else, and he thinks he can tow an 8000 pound trailer?

Just hoping that people understand the limits of these vehicles and drive safe.
I was hoping to sell the tow dolly and get 1 car enclosed trailer (@3200#) for my small car (@2800#). It might be better to buy a new toad that can be flat towed.
Thanks for the input & safe travels
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Old 05-24-2018, 08:51 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mich F View Post
I don't believe they are talking about an 8,000# trailer with a 500# tongue weight. Those are just two separate limits. You would have about a 6% tongue weight and that trailer would be all over the road. They are saying the hitch is rated for 8,000#, (even though Ford only has a 7,500# difference between GVWR and GCWR on the E450s).They also limit the tongue weight to 500#, which has probably more to do with the distance between the rear axle and hitch on many RVs which would add considerably more weight on the rear axle than the 500# at the hitch, than any shortcomings in the hitch or frame.

If you were towing a heavier toad four down or even on a dolly the tongue weight would obviously not be an issue.

The OP claimed it is a weak frame extension and I believe he might be right.
I compared all the Thor class C Four winds motorhomes with towing 8000#/500#TW's .
The distance from rear axle to back of unit varies from 130" to 163" or almost 3 feet, with the same drive train.
Safe travels
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Old 05-24-2018, 09:17 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bry899 View Post
The OP claimed it is a weak frame extension and I believe he might be right.
I compared all the Thor class C Four winds motorhomes with towing 8000#/500#TW's .
The distance from rear axle to back of unit varies from 130" to 163" or almost 3 feet, with the same drive train.
Safe travels
I believe the OP's claim, over a year ago, is wrong. I believe the frame extension is fine. Putting 500# on a hitch 11 - 14' behind the rear axle of a motorhome is adding considerably more than 500# to that rear axle.
Another issue is that not all class IV hitches are weight distribution hitches. That particular hitch has no mention of weight distribution tongue weight and only the 8,000# tow limit . It's not a weight distribution hitch.
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Old 05-25-2018, 08:10 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mich F View Post
I believe the OP's claim, over a year ago, is wrong. I believe the frame extension is fine. Putting 500# on a hitch 11 - 14' behind the rear axle of a motorhome is adding considerably more than 500# to that rear axle.
Another issue is that not all class IV hitches are weight distribution hitches. That particular hitch has no mention of weight distribution tongue weight and only the 8,000# tow limit . It's not a weight distribution hitch.
OK thanks for the info:
I was concerned that a frame failure would allow the trailer to separate from the Motorhome. That would be scary!
But you have me convinced that I can tow the 8,000# trailer and exceed the 500# tongue weight and the worst case is the Rear axle will eventually fail, which would give noticeable indications before complete failure. And as long as I can bring it to the Ford dealer without the trailer I could have the repairs fixed under warranty.
Thanks & Safe Travels
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Old 05-25-2018, 08:41 PM   #106
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Assuming you have an E 450, Ford rates it tow 7,500# . Thor has decided to put an 8,000# hitch on it. The hitch supposedly has a 500# tongue weight. At what weight would the hitch break - who knows ?

How much does your MH fully loaded for travel, with all gear and passengers weigh ? How close are you to the 14,500 GVWR ? Would you be over the 22,000# GCWR pulling an 8,000# trailer with an 800# - 1000# tongue weight.

How would that MH drive/handle with that much tongue weight and trailer weight back there?

I wasn't trying to convince you that exceeding any of the limits was a good idea.
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Old 05-27-2018, 08:54 PM   #107
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Bad Misinformation

I thought I could use this message board to get good Motorhome towing information. Yes there are some knowledgeable posts but there is also some really bad info.
I have spent the past week calling and stopping at truck repair shops and qualified Hitch installation shops. I also did some research online about the Thor Four winds class c Motorhomes 2016-2018 years.

These Motorhomes are equipped with a rated 8,000 pound Hitch towing receiver with a 500 pound tongue weight limit.

An interesting Note: to see the Ford original specs on your vehicle before the motorhome manufacturer added anything, sort of like a "Build sheet", Do a VIN lookup at:

https://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/vindecoder.php


My Van before its conversion is rated to Tow 8,500 pounds, and 850# tongue weight.
The only Change that was made by Thor to affect the towing capacity is the Frame extension. Engine, Tranny, Drivetrain, Brakes, Steering components, suspension, etc is all Ford stock.

After having my motorhome checked by the various shops they unanimously agreed that the frame extension that was added is the component that would not be able to handle the extra weight.
They also agreed that the Rear axle can handle the weight whether it was placed inside the unit or on the tongue, as long as the total weight does not exceed the total weight capacity of that axle.

My main concern is can I travel safe, towing a 6,000# trailer with @ 600-700# Tongue weight, and if so what component has to be modified.
I am talking about towing within the specified limits (GVWR & GCVWR) that are set by Thor.
It appears that the only possible solution would be to reinforce the frame extension.

Also you can't use a weight distributing hitch on these vehicles either, Probably because it would add to much stress on the frame extension.

I also would like to make it known what would happen if you towed a heavier tongue weight trailer and the frame extension failed. The frame extension with the Hitch receiver would break away from the motorhome. That means the chains and emergency trailer brakes would serve no function, and the trailer would create a serious danger to anyone around.
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Old 05-27-2018, 09:43 PM   #108
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Your motor home is not built on a van. It is built on a cut away chassis, which has some different specs than a van or wagon. Ford rates the E 450 with a V10 engine with a maximum 14,500# GVWR and a maximum 22,000# GCWR. I have also seen in some Ford literature, where they state the maximum you can tow is the difference between those two numbers.
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Old 05-28-2018, 06:25 AM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mich F View Post
Your motor home is not built on a van. It is built on a cut away chassis, which has some different specs than a van or wagon. Ford rates the E 450 with a V10 engine with a maximum 14,500# GVWR and a maximum 22,000# GCWR. I have also seen in some Ford literature, where they state the maximum you can tow is the difference between those two numbers.
SORRY BUT FROM THE FORD WEBSITE:
Ford E-Series is the popular choice for Class 3–4 cutaway vans covering an extensive range of business and recreational applications — emergency service, commercial trades, bus and shuttle transport, motorhomes. They’re offered in the E-350 single rear wheel model, followed by the E-350/E-450 versions with dual rear wheels and higher GVWRs for handling the broad range of heavy-duty applications.
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Old 05-28-2018, 06:30 AM   #110
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Stop the misinformation

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mich F View Post
Your motor home is not built on a van. It is built on a cut away chassis, which has some different specs than a van or wagon. Ford rates the E 450 with a V10 engine with a maximum 14,500# GVWR and a maximum 22,000# GCWR. I have also seen in some Ford literature, where they state the maximum you can tow is the difference between those two numbers.
FROM THE FORD WEBSITE: THE VAN CUTAWAY
10,000-lb. Towing Capacity
With their full frame construction and standard V10 muscle, E-Series Cutaway models have an impressive towing capacity up to 10,000 lbs.* Plus GCWRs from 13,000 lbs. (E-350) to 22,000 lbs. (E-450). Add the convenience of available power or manually operated telescoping mirrors. Also, there’s an available factory-integrated trailer brake controller (TBC) that synchronizes the vehicle and trailer brakes for seamless operation. What’s more, the Ford TorqShift® six-speed automatic transmission has an integrated driver-selectable tow-haul mode that automatically compensates for altitude, grade and load conditions.
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Old 05-28-2018, 06:56 AM   #111
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Originally Posted by bry899 View Post
FROM THE FORD WEBSITE: THE VAN CUTAWAY
10,000-lb. Towing Capacity
With their full frame construction and standard V10 muscle, E-Series Cutaway models have an impressive towing capacity up to 10,000 lbs.* Plus GCWRs from 13,000 lbs. (E-350) to 22,000 lbs. (E-450). Add the convenience of available power or manually operated telescoping mirrors. Also, there’s an available factory-integrated trailer brake controller (TBC) that synchronizes the vehicle and trailer brakes for seamless operation. What’s more, the Ford TorqShift® six-speed automatic transmission has an integrated driver-selectable tow-haul mode that automatically compensates for altitude, grade and load conditions.
I am not putting out misinformation while you seem to be cherry picking information.

You are linking information from the 2018 Ford website,which could be different from previous models. Regardless you didn't add this disclaimer.

* Based on use or upfit.

This is also from Ford's website
E-SERIES CUTAWAY & STRIPPED CHASSIS
Maximum Trailer Weight = GCWR – Vehicle GVW or 10,000 pounds, whichever is less.

Have you weighed your MH fully loaded for a trip to see where you are compared to the GVWR ? Many don't have much OCCC to play with.
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