Community Forums

Epferber · 01-15-2019, 09:19 AM

Hope to purchase a new class C about mid March. Will be our first motor home, but been RVing for 47 years. Was considering a Navion 24D, but getting scared of it after reading problem threads. Maybe Jayco, other? Any help concerning mfg quality, service (no dealers close to us in WV), comfort, operating cost comparison ( diesel vs. gas, Ford vs. MB, Dodge, etc.). Other important considerations I’m forgetting?

cherv · 01-15-2019, 09:37 AM

Hi, consider jayco class c 22j, its 24'8'' ours is great for us, both retired. There is other mfg. Units that have small 25' class c's. I would even consider going to indiana near factory for dealers. Might get lower prices.

Winterbagoal · 01-15-2019, 11:00 AM

We like our Navion 24V. I'd buy it again. Great fuel economy, less engine noise under load, greater power at lower RPMs, no doghouse. Parts might be more expensive, depends what fails or needs replacing. Places to get them fixed versus other chassis, is purely location dependent. More Ford dealerships around, but not all can work on a larger motorhome. Diesel is (usually) more expensive, but the better fuel economy negates that one. Diesel oil changes cost more, but happen much less frequently.

tbillet · 01-15-2019, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winterbagoal

Diesel is (usually) more expensive, but the better fuel economy negates that one.

I have owned both gas & diesel cars. The increase in fuel economy doesn’t come close to covering the difference in fuel & maintenance of a diesel. Even our Audi TDI cost more than our comparable gas SUV’s to operate. I’ve driven both Dodge & Ford diesel pickups for 20yrs, and the $ delta between gas & diesel fuel has continued to grow at the pump most of those.

There are benefits to diesel vs gas such as more power/torque and drive train longevity, but fuel economy negating fuel price difference is not a valid reason.

Ret.LEO · 01-15-2019, 05:10 PM

Right now in our area diesel is 75 cents per gallon higher than gas. Extra maintenance expense, higher labor rates, less shops willing to work on it..........gas all the way. The Ford V-10 with proper maintenance will probably last as long as a diesel. Any shop can work on the engine and parts are readily available,

Winterbagoal · 01-15-2019, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbillet

I have owned both gas & diesel cars. The increase in fuel economy doesn’t come close to covering the difference in fuel & maintenance of a diesel. Even our Audi TDI cost more than our comparable gas SUV’s to operate. I’ve driven both Dodge & Ford diesel pickups for 20yrs, and the $ delta between gas & diesel fuel has continued to grow at the pump most of those.

There are benefits to diesel vs gas such as more power/torque and drive train longevity, but fuel economy negating fuel price difference is not a valid reason.

Apples and oranges. The discussion is about class C motorhomes, not diesel and gas cars. I'm sure there are a lot of gasoline powered cars that get decent fuel economy, close to their diesel counterparts, but that's irrelevant to this topic.
Do the math. On average I get 15mpg, which is probably almost twice what an average class C gasser with a Ford V10 gets. The national average price difference between a gallon of diesel and gas is 25%. I know, because I get the EIA national gas and diesel pricing (average, and by PADD) reports weekly. Even if I only get 50% better fuel economy than the gasser, as in he gets 10mpg to my 15mpg, the diesel is ahead of the game.
Simple math.

twinboat · 01-15-2019, 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winterbagoal

Apples and oranges. The discussion is about class C motorhomes, not diesel and gas cars. I'm sure there are a lot of gasoline powered cars that get decent fuel economy, close to their diesel counterparts, but that's irrelevant to this topic.
Do the math. On average I get 15mpg, which is probably almost twice what an average class C gasser with a Ford V10 gets. The national average price difference between a gallon of diesel and gas is 25%. I know, because I get the EIA national gas and diesel pricing (average, and by PADD) reports weekly. Even if I only get 50% better fuel economy than the gasser, as in he gets 10mpg to my 15mpg, the diesel is ahead of the game.
Simple math.

How much more did it cost to buy and service the diesel powered MH ?

If you don't figure that in, your comparison is apples and oranges.

Even If you payed $15,000 more for the deisel MH, that could have bought you 6000 gallons of gas. That will get you 48,000 miles at 8 MPG.

randyrv · 01-15-2019, 05:42 PM

We have 4 mercedes sprinter vans at my place of work. They all were purchased new. They all are diesels and perform good. They all have been to dealer numerous times for constant check engine lights. We were finally told by dealer the check engine light on is something you will have to get used to, we were told to drive them unless the check engine light flashes. They drive nice, get good fuel economy, have good power but also are expensive to maintain and not everyone can work on them. The les scwab in our area cant even do an alignment. If you have lots of money and like the dealer get the diesel.

tbillet · 01-15-2019, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Winterbagoal

Apples and oranges. The discussion is about class C motorhomes, not diesel and gas cars. I'm sure there are a lot of gasoline powered cars that get decent fuel economy, close to their diesel counterparts, but that's irrelevant to this topic.

Do the math. On average I get 15mpg, which is probably almost twice what an average class C gasser with a Ford V10 gets. The national average price difference between a gallon of diesel and gas is 25%. I know, because I get the EIA national gas and diesel pricing (average, and by PADD) reports weekly. Even if I only get 50% better fuel economy than the gasser, as in he gets 10mpg to my 15mpg, the diesel is ahead of the game.

Simple math.

Simple math gets more complex when your replacing EGR valves, changing 3x the oil at each service interval, 2 fuel filters, etc, etc.
Not trying to be argumentative, I love my diesel pickup, especially when pulling 10k lbs of equipment.
My point was...the argument for “better mileage outweighs higher cost” is fiction. You won’t catchup to the cost difference in an RV that is driven xx,xxx miles/year.

avfordguy · 01-15-2019, 09:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ret.LEO

Right now in our area diesel is 75 cents per gallon higher than gas. Extra maintenance expense, higher labor rates, less shops willing to work on it..........gas all the way. The Ford V-10 with proper maintenance will probably last as long as a diesel. Any shop can work on the engine and parts are readily available,

That's why I dumped a Dp and went back to gas

Winterbagoal · 01-16-2019, 06:49 AM

And so it goes, and the endless debate "diesel versus gas" rages on. On countless threads, across endless forums. It's one of those classics, where you're not going to change my mind/anecdotal experiences/opinions any quicker than I'll change yours. It always starts the same way, and ends the same way.

So far, the Navion has been the best overall motorhome I've owned, and I've owned both gas and diesel, in large and small sizes.
As always, YMMV, literally.
Adios.

Mpowers112 · 01-17-2019, 09:17 AM

The primary reasons for us to go with a Winnebago Navion/View was quality and fuel economy. We have had virtually no problems with our Navion and get great mileage with the MB diesel. Workmanship in assembly and engineering of coach / house assembly makes this a no brainer for us. Solid frame and insulation reduce noise and provide safety while on the road in the event of a collision.

If you anticipate putting on a lot of mileage then the diesel makes a lot of sense overall. Just look at the NAPA pricing guide and you know they don’t determine resale values based on mileage. That should tell you something about the longevity expectations of a diesel over gas engines. If you expect to use the rig for short trips on weekends then look at the gas units but if you expect to really explore the country you should consider the diesel.

eddndee · 01-17-2019, 02:05 PM

Just my 2 cents... as I read the problems my brothers have with their DP A’s and what problems I don’t have with my gasser C, and we all enjoying the Safari quality we expect it is a no brainer for me. Of course, If I was towing a toad back and forth across the country, full time, it might be a different story.

Winterbagoal · 01-17-2019, 05:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tbillet

Simple math gets more complex when your replacing EGR valves, changing 3x the oil at each service interval, 2 fuel filters, etc, etc.
Not trying to be argumentative, I love my diesel pickup, especially when pulling 10k lbs of equipment.
My point was...the argument for “better mileage outweighs higher cost” is fiction. You won’t catchup to the cost difference in an RV that is driven xx,xxx miles/year.

Aha, now I see where the discussion diverged.
I just looked at 2 "thank you" messages I got from this thread, and reread the original post that you "quoted", when you weren't being argumentative. In context, I was talking strictly about the better fuel economy of my diesel against comparable gassers, offsetting the difference in the cost of a gallon of diesel versus a gallon of gas. My point was about the price of the 2 types of fuel, not the overall costs of operating a diesel or gas powered coach.