Community Forums

vermontbuild · 03-02-2017, 07:07 AM

We are new to the RV community, and live on a isolated farm in southern Vermont. We have a couple of accessible flat parking spots with beautiful views. Would fellow RVers be interested in boondocking here? Power (20 A ) would be available and water at one of the locations, but no dumping. We are thinking of having portapottys available. We would charge a small nightly fee. Is this something people do? Your thoughts and comments would be appreciated. Thanks

computerguy · 03-02-2017, 07:55 AM

Definitely check local zoning and don't forget about insurance. Once you start charging you are opening yourself up to a host of other issues.
If not charging you can look at boondockerswelcome.com

twinboat · 03-02-2017, 03:14 PM

I was contemplating something like that on my rural riverfront home in NY.

Then I thought, one accidental injury of a " guest " and your in court defending against loosing your home.

I will still offer a spot to friends and family but they are worth the risk.

It's a shame that it's this way but it's what we've become.

RubiconTrail · 03-02-2017, 03:33 PM

I have a fair amount of private property in California. It's in an area where people tend to camp, and there's a public (dirt) road going through it, so lots of opportunities to camp. I was worried about this exact problem, so I checked with a lawyer. He said if there was an invitation, there is liability, if no invitation, there is no liability. So if you invite, but don't charge, the same risk applies if you invite but do charge. If you do what I do, which is not invite anyone, not charge and just let them camp, there's virtually no liability whatsoever.

I appreciate what the OP is trying to do, I think it's very cool. I miss the old days.

MisterT · 03-02-2017, 03:39 PM

but the fact that you are allowing someone on your property is the same as having 'invited' someone ... it's no different than if you have allowed someone to drive your car several occasions before, but this time they just took the car without asking - your insurance will stay be involved in the claim regardless - and your home/property insurance will be VERY interested if they find that you 'don't invite' folks onto your property, yet they stay there overnight! ( and so will someone's lawyer after an accident on your property occurs )

MisterT · 03-02-2017, 03:53 PM

though I certainly appreciate the idea of property owners having sites available for overnighting or dry camping, etc... we just live in a very litigious environment where even the best intentioned RV owners can pose legal and insurance issues, even without realizing it.

I have a story about that - a friend and his young family visited a friends house one night for a summer cookout. One of his children, an 8 year old boy, jumped off the back deck and fell farther to the ground than he expected, breaking his arm in the process. His family had health insurance, so they ran down to the emergency room and had it taken care of, cast and all.
A few weeks later his health insurance company called him to discuss what happened, and where.

I got a call a few minutes later - I'm a friend who is an insurance agent, and he wanted to pick my brain about why they would be asking him for his friends Name and Address, and whether they had Homeowners insurance - as though it was none of the health insurance companies business!
My friend was concerned that his friend and his friends home insurance would be pulled into the claim, and he didn't feel as though it was any of the health insurance company's business whether his friend had insurance or not, it was his own child's fault, not his friends.

Well, the moral of the story is that companies make inquiries as to accidents for many reasons - to know if it's covered, of course, but also as to whether someone else could be making a claim for the same accident(in this case, his Friend and their Home policy).
The insurer just wanted to confirm that the friend was not also making a claim on their home policy, since the health insurer would then 'subrogate' the claim payment back to the health policy so that the injured child's policy would not have to pay for someone else's 'fault'(i.e., the home owner was negligent in allowing a 'visitor' to jump off of their back deck!)

So, legal concerns create certain issues, and insurance concerns create even more, even with well intentioned friends, invitees, and even non-invitees(that's a different story about a breaking-and-entering case where the 'breakee' sued the homeowner because he got 'hurt' in the process due to the homeowners lack of maintenance of existing broken glass on a back window he 'entered'!).

S Bradley · 03-02-2017, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterT

though I certainly appreciate the idea of property owners having sites available for overnighting or dry camping, etc... we just live in a very litigious environment where even the best intentioned RV owners can pose legal and insurance issues, even without realizing it.

I have a story about that - a friend and his young family visited a friends house one night for a summer cookout. One of his children, an 8 year old boy, jumped off the back deck and fell farther to the ground than he expected, breaking his arm in the process. His family had health insurance, so they ran down to the emergency room and had it taken care of, cast and all.
A few weeks later his health insurance company called him to discuss what happened, and where.

I got a call a few minutes later - I'm a friend who is an insurance agent, and he wanted to pick my brain about why they would be asking him for his friends Name and Address, and whether they had Homeowners insurance - as though it was none of the health insurance companies business!
My friend was concerned that his friend and his friends home insurance would be pulled into the claim, and he didn't feel as though it was any of the health insurance company's business whether his friend had insurance or not, it was his own child's fault, not his friends.

Well, the moral of the story is that companies make inquiries as to accidents for many reasons - to know if it's covered, of course, but also as to whether someone else could be making a claim for the same accident(in this case, his Friend and their Home policy).
The insurer just wanted to confirm that the friend was not also making a claim on their home policy, since the health insurer would then 'subrogate' the claim payment back to the health policy so that the injured child's policy would not have to pay for someone else's 'fault'(i.e., the home owner was negligent in allowing a 'visitor' to jump off of their back deck!)

So, legal concerns create certain issues, and insurance concerns create even more, even with well intentioned friends, invitees, and even non-invitees(that's a different story about a breaking-and-entering case where the 'breakee' sued the homeowner because he got 'hurt' in the process due to the homeowners lack of maintenance of existing broken glass on a back window he 'entered'!).

Isn't it wonderful to have such a litigious society.

MisterT · 03-02-2017, 04:24 PM

...after saying all that though, please provide your ADDRESS so I can come by and dry camp! Please!

it's fun.....

(my parents actually do this on their property because they are Airstreamers and part of a 'sharing' group when someone is in the area and wants a friendly overnight private site

)

Superslif · 03-02-2017, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Isn't it wonderful to have such a litigious society.

How true....

I think there are professional suit filers out there that make a living at it.

Hgrace56 · 03-02-2017, 04:48 PM

You might also find yourself in an eviction issue like Air BnB hosts have fallen into.
Could take 90 days host get someone out.
Maybe you could start a private Club and offer something but I would never risk this.
Good luck

MisterT · 03-02-2017, 04:54 PM

https://www.boondockerswelcome.com/

RubiconTrail · 03-02-2017, 04:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MisterT

but the fact that you are allowing someone on your property is the same as having 'invited' someone ...

Not really, especially in the eyes of California law. There is a specific statute. If I don't know they are there, I cannot have invited them. The downside of trying to evict people from areas where they have camped with their families for many years would be considerable (I actually think many have a prescriptive right). Easier to not know. They are typically nice and respectful people and cause no harm.

Stiltner · 03-02-2017, 05:06 PM

I'm no attorney, and I can certainly see everyone's point here, but I can't bridge an invitation to boondock versus an invitation to having someone spend the night in a residence. What if the residential guest slips in the restroom with injuries? There is no willful intent to harm, wreckless endangerment, or negligence. In lieu of charging the fee, one could suggest a donation.....or open a boondocking business and get insurance. Some salesperson will gladly sell insurance.

It is a down right shame. Both twinboat and RubiconTrail have properties in very nice areas that I would stay in without hesitation and flip them a 20 for the hospitality.

MisterT · 03-02-2017, 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stiltner

I'm no attorney...but...In lieu of charging the fee, one could suggest a donation.....or open a boondocking business and get insurance. Some salesperson will gladly sell insurance.

Sorry, but this type of insurance coverage does not exists, which is why it's a problematic venture, whether personally or business wise. You can't say that you don't 'know' someone is on your property, and at the same time tell your insurance company to cover this type of activity.