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-   -   Help with Diagnostic Port J1939/J1708 (https://www.irv2.com/forums/f112/help-with-diagnostic-port-j1939-j1708-506868.html)

Moho_Driver 09-16-2020 11:05 AM

Help with Diagnostic Port J1939/J1708
 
I am trying to locate the diagnostic port on our '98 Intrigue #10678. I currently have a Silverleaf VMS 200 EL with a heavily pixalated screen and would like to change over to Bluefire's Bluetooth option.

I can follow the wires from the Silverleaf to the back of a rectangular 12 pin connector mounted just to the left of my steering column, where they are spliced in. This port clearly reads "Diagnostic Port", but in the research I have done, it appears to be for the Allison transmission only and not the Cummins, but I could be wrong. I have followed the wires from the rear of the port, but cant locate the J1939 port anywhere. I have also read that I should have a port in the fuel filter bay close to the engine block heater plug, I do not have this port. I do have the Cummins 8.3 350 ISC and the paperwork all shows that it is electronic. What am I missing? Tips to locate the port? Any help is appreciated.

Thanks!

CountryFit 09-16-2020 12:55 PM

Ours is at right above the fuel filters. I used it to pull the info from ECU it worked.

Moho_Driver 09-16-2020 02:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CountryFit (Post 5442906)
Ours is at right above the fuel filters. I used it to pull the info from ECU it worked.

Thanks. I went and looked again. Oddly enough, on the right side of that bay there is a fuse box mounted to the side wall, with bundled wires coming from the chassis. Coming out of that same hole (from the chassis) is another bundle of wires that run nowhere, but are capped on the ends. There are six individual wires, all capped. I am assuming that might be there the port was, but is no longer. I'm not sure why that would have ever been removed... Is it possible it was removed to keep from interfering with the Silverleaf?? Now I'm wondering if I am going to run into the same issue under the dash and it was possibly removed..

CountryFit 09-16-2020 03:14 PM

Those capped wires (we have 4) are numbered as spares from dash and bedroom. Based on what you were telling us, I suspect that you have the port.

Moho_Driver 09-16-2020 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CountryFit (Post 5443080)
Those capped wires (we have 4) are numbered as spares from dash and bedroom. Based on what you were telling us, I suspect that you have the port.

Well I sure wish it would present itself. I took the panel off that is next to the drivers seat under the Allison shift pad to see if it had gotten pulled in there somehow, and still nothing. Just strange that I cant find it one in the filter bay or under the dash. I did go through my engine/chassis material again to confirm and it is electronic; and indeed it is. In fact, some of the material refers to the port for diagnostics, just doesn't spell out its location.

Moho_Driver 09-16-2020 03:51 PM

Now I'm reading on the Silverleaf website that CC didn't install the 6-pin plug until 2000 and they relied on the ALDL plug before that. That is the plug I have found. I guess it would make sense that the Silverleaf is hardwired to that since Silverleaf generally uses the J1939 as well. I suppose mystery solved, but now I'm not sure of the Bluefire will work for my coach.

""Different Chassis manufactures installed (Implemented) the Deutsch Plug at different times near the Steering Column. For example Safari implemented the Deutsch 6 Pin in 1996 (it was the Wrong 6 Pin, but they tried), On The Other Hand, Country Coach did not implement the Deutsch 6 Pin until 2000, relying on the ALDL plug for the Transmission and Engine Technicians to plug diagnostic equipment into. We have available for the VMSpc and VMS, both types of Deutsch Plugs, AND NOW the ALDL Plugs as well.""

CountryFit 09-16-2020 10:42 PM

Good to know you figured it out :thumb:

Kodiakan 09-17-2020 02:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moho_Driver (Post 5442794)
I am trying to locate the diagnostic port on our '98 Intrigue #10678. I currently have a Silverleaf VMS 200 EL with a heavily pixalated screen and would like to change over to Bluefire's Bluetooth option.

I can follow the wires from the Silverleaf to the back of a rectangular 12 pin connector mounted just to the left of my steering column, where they are spliced in. This port clearly reads "Diagnostic Port", but in the research I have done, it appears to be for the Allison transmission only and not the Cummins, but I could be wrong. I have followed the wires from the rear of the port, but cant locate the J1939 port anywhere. I have also read that I should have a port in the fuel filter bay close to the engine block heater plug, I do not have this port. I do have the Cummins 8.3 350 ISC and the paperwork all shows that it is electronic. What am I missing? Tips to locate the port? Any help is appreciated.

Thanks!

I have a 2001 Allure 8.3 ISC and had the same issue. I wrestled with it for months including contacting the founder/owner of Bluefire. Here is what I found. The flat port you spoke of is a port to the engine and tranny. You will need an adapter though which basically transfers the flat to the round 7 pin plug. At least i think its 7, anyway it is the older style for our rigs. I wish I could remember the adapter plug number but cant. All the info is in my coach 4000 miles away. In the morning I will search my emails as I think I might have a pic there.
Monte

f360racer 03-18-2021 10:10 PM

J1939 plug can be spliced with Y J1939 extension plug
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Moho_Driver (Post 5443127)
Now I'm reading on the Silverleaf website that CC didn't install the 6-pin plug until 2000 and they relied on the ALDL plug before that. That is the plug I have found. I guess it would make sense that the Silverleaf is hardwired to that since Silverleaf generally uses the J1939 as well. I suppose mystery solved, but now I'm not sure of the Bluefire will work for my coach.

""Different Chassis manufactures installed (Implemented) the Deutsch Plug at different times near the Steering Column. For example Safari implemented the Deutsch 6 Pin in 1996 (it was the Wrong 6 Pin, but they tried), On The Other Hand, Country Coach did not implement the Deutsch 6 Pin until 2000, relying on the ALDL plug for the Transmission and Engine Technicians to plug diagnostic equipment into. We have available for the VMSpc and VMS, both types of Deutsch Plugs, AND NOW the ALDL Plugs as well.""

I have the N1939 6-pin plug that sends data to my Silverleaf VMS240. It still works but they are not upgradeable. Displays are no longer supported by Silverleaf except their $4000+ glass dash or $1500 VMS350 with limitations. Has anyone used the Bluefire on a Country Coach yet? Bluefire makes a great Glass Dash option with any iOS iPad or iPhone or Android or Windows tablet. Im not looking for a glass dash exactly like CC made for Lexas in 2003. Im looking to display the same data in an easier modern way that the VMS240 shows primitively now. Plus with a splitter from the J1939 I can also get TPMS data from PressurePro TPMS data and or Bluefire data system that will be displayed on my new 10.1 new stereo head unit.

CountryFit 03-19-2021 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by f360racer (Post 5678210)
I have the N1939 6-pin plug that sends data to my Silverleaf VMS240. It still works but they are not upgradeable. Displays are no longer supported by Silverleaf except their $4000+ glass dash or $1500 VMS350 with limitations. Has anyone used the Bluefire on a Country Coach yet? Bluefire makes a great Glass Dash option with any iOS iPad or iPhone or Android or Windows tablet. I’m not looking for a glass dash exactly like CC made for Lexa’s in 2003. I’m looking to display the same data in an easier modern way that the VMS240 shows primitively now. Plus with a splitter from the J1939 I can also get TPMS data from PressurePro TPMS data and or Bluefire data system that will be displayed on my new 10.1” new stereo head unit.

Do you have an ALDL or J1939 port under the dash? Bluefire doesn't offer a 6-pin J1708 any more but a 9-pin J1939 adapter. If you only have an ALDL port under the dash, you would need to get two converters - ALDL to J1708 and J1708 to J1939, (there isn't an adapter from ALDL to J1939 directly, at least for now and I haven't seen one). If you already have a type 1 J1939 under the dash, lucky you. The rear J1939 port is too far away that class 2 bluetooth Bluefire is using could only travel about 30 feet in the line of sight.

Certainly BF looks good.

f360racer 03-19-2021 02:32 PM

Looks like an ALDL to J1939 adaptor is available
 
2 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by CountryFit (Post 5678385)
Do you have an ALDL or J1939 port under the dash? Bluefire doesn't offer a 6-pin J1708 any more but a 9-pin J1939 adapter. If you only have an ALDL port under the dash, you would need to get two converters - ALDL to J1708 and J1708 to J1939, (there isn't an adapter from ALDL to J1939 directly, at least for now and I haven't seen one). If you already have a type 1 J1939 under the dash, lucky you. The rear J1939 port is too far away that class 2 bluetooth Bluefire is using could only travel about 30 feet in the line of sight.

Certainly BF looks good.

If ALDL is this OBD2 plug: Arteckin Type 2 Green J1939 9pin Female to OBD2 Female Cable than it looks like there is an adapter.


Great if I can skip one adapter. At this time I'm not sure the direction I will go. At this time I was only looking at adding TPMS to my RV. But in doing so I wanted to check on compatibility with Silverleaf VMS first and then with Bluefire. Both now have the capability with TPMS, Silverleaf with TST and Bluefire with Pressure Pro but I would need to upgrade to VMS350 to use TST TPMS for Silverleaf. That upgrade costs $1145 plus install if needed. Of course Silverleaf offers VMSpc but it doesn't have TPMS yet. Per Gary at Silverleaf "it's coming but he said they have been saying that for two plus years." Other option is the Bluefire BT adapter which can work with Pressure Pro Pulse TPMS (not the Pressure Pro Pulse FX system).

Or just skip the "new" VMS and buy a cheaper TPMS system that works separately. I have added an attachment that shows the connectors at the back of my new 10.1" stereo headunit. Is there an adapter for the type of connector for Connector 2? Which is the CAN/iPod Port. the second photo is the VMS-350 pinout document. will try and upload the VMS-350 manual as well.

f360racer 03-19-2021 04:16 PM

Silverleaf VMS-350 manual
 
3 Attachment(s)
Silverleaf VMS-350 upgrade from VMS-240

This allows for TPMS capability with TFT-507 TPMS system instead of Smarttire which is no longer supported or difficult to get new parts. I received this from Gary at Silverleaf as an option to upgrade VMS-240. Mine still works but I want TPMS and mine doesn't have it or they don't work anymore.

CountryFit 03-19-2021 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by f360racer (Post 5679002)
If ALDL is this OBD2 plug: Arteckin Type 2 Green J1939 9pin Female to OBD2 Female Cable than it looks like there is an adapter.


Great if I can skip one adapter. At this time I'm not sure the direction I will go. At this time I was only looking at adding TPMS to my RV. But in doing so I wanted to check on compatibility with Silverleaf VMS first and then with Bluefire. Both now have the capability with TPMS, Silverleaf with TST and Bluefire with Pressure Pro but I would need to upgrade to VMS350 to use TST TPMS for Silverleaf. That upgrade costs $1145 plus install if needed. Of course Silverleaf offers VMSpc but it doesn't have TPMS yet. Per Gary at Silverleaf "it's coming but he said they have been saying that for two plus years." Other option is the Bluefire BT adapter which can work with Pressure Pro Pulse TPMS (not the Pressure Pro Pulse FX system).

Or just skip the "new" VMS and buy a cheaper TPMS system that works separately. I have added an attachment that shows the connectors at the back of my new 10.1" stereo headunit. Is there an adapter for the type of connector for Connector 2? Which is the CAN/iPod Port. the second photo is the VMS-350 pinout document. will try and upload the VMS-350 manual as well.

No, ALDL is a GM version of OBD1. It has 12 pin with a rectangular layout. Not sure yours a 07 Affinity has it or not, maybe you have a J1708 or J1939 round one under the dash.

TPMS is not part of CAN bus. Some people use a standalone LCD display. But it is a personal preference if you want it to be integrated.

f360racer 03-31-2021 08:49 AM

J1939 detailed article
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MichalH (Post 5691931)
Hey! I recommend you checking out this article about J1939. I gained quite a lot of information and their support even helped me further, so that was amazing.

That is very helpful information thanks for sharing.


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