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Gased 07-24-2021 11:34 PM

Agreed Value
 
hi,
I pick my 22 year old coach up soon and have a million things to finalize and have been working on the insurance for a week, no dealer is involved. I did not know which coach I was going to choose and when I did I found I had wasted effort and been looking for the wrong information.

My coach is likely, like a lot of other prevost built to suit someone and not a cookie cutter and that only matters in the insurance dept. I feel like the agreed value will be my best bet even if it costs more. To replace or fix this thing more is the key word. I am counting on the maintenance being done from the records and that deserves a different post and matters here only from a value standpoint.

How have you guys handled it? I feel an appraisal is in order to put bullets in my gun. How do I handle that to get started? Is there a nationwide coach appraisal service? What are the best insurers for these coach types?

Thank you

PanJH 07-25-2021 05:41 AM

With my antique vehicles, I have agreed value coverage. They just had me take pictures and send them to them with the caveat that they could come and inspect if necessary. Pictures ended up all they needed.

153stars 07-25-2021 05:43 AM

Progressive didn't give me any grief, set price was within reason of other similar coaches listed at the time. But you may want an appraisal. PO was good guy , he let me work on MH in his pole barn . It was worth 5K more before I drove it home. I could remove the Aquahot and genny and easily sell for 1/2 price of NADA. Yes you will pay more just like insuring a restored classic instead of 15yr old vehicle worth 1/6th or less the price of new.
EDIT I see the classic analogy was already being typed up lol

mr.tommy 07-25-2021 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gased (Post 5845206)
My coach is likely, like a lot of other prevost built to suit someone and not a cookie cutter and that only matters in the insurance dept. I feel like the agreed value will be my best bet even if it costs more. To replace or fix this thing more is the key word. I am counting on the maintenance being done from the records and that deserves a different post and matters here only from a value standpoint.

How have you guys handled it? I feel an appraisal is in order to put bullets in my gun. How do I handle that to get started? Is there a nationwide coach appraisal service? What are the best insurers for these coach types?

Thank you

Well I'm not sure I understand your first paragraph or not but JIC I want to clarify something. Whether the coach has had good previous maintenance or not it doesn't matter to insurance companies as far as appraising the rig. They are going to base the value on how "they" value the coach with similar coaches of the year, engine type, your driving record, where your domicile is, have you had any accidents or claims in the past 3yrs., whether your FT or not etc, etc.

I currently have Nationwide. I just renewed my policy. Good rates and vanishing deductible with no claims. I asked about an agreed value. They said I would have to have an appraisal but that appraisal would be good for 3yrs. My previous underwriter—National General—said I needed a new appraisal too but every year if I wanted an Agreed Value OR in the event of a total loss, I would need to prove that my value is much higher than what they offer if I wasn't pleased with there value. Nationwide said the same thing. I chose to not get an appraisal because it's to expensive and too big of a hassle in my view being a FTer.

Appraisals usually run around $250-$400 or so depending on the coach. The cost of an appraisal will be based on all the systems it has, how intense it is and who's doing it. I'd expect your coach would be more than normal.

Nationwide told me they had a list of appraisers if I wanted a reference, but I would rather have an independent appraiser if I was going to do that. I chose not to get it appraised. But in my case I keep immaculate records of everything I do, receipts, pictures and videos as my evidence. That's the risk I took.

Also, I've learned and practice that ANY small fixes or accidents—as I define by anything under a $1,000-$1,500—I do myself and pay myself and DO NOT report them to the Insurance Co. for a claim. Except if it was a windshield replacement. The reason is, by the time you pay your deductible and the insurance company fixes the problem you really only saved a few hundred bucks. BUT here's the kicker, you DID file a claim and once you do that when your next premium comes back trust me it will be much higher.

I had a claim with National General 2.5yrs. ago and they took care of it el pronto. But my next premium upon renewal went up $1,400. That's when I moved to Nationwide and they DID NOT penalize me with a claim because the way they saw the claim it was a "no fault" claim. National General saw it as an "at fault claim" therefore the higher premium. So I naturally switched to Nationwide and have been with them now 2 going on 3yrs. and no premium increases for our motorhome or toad.

If you decide to shop for another company once a claim is ever filed, the first things the new company are going to ask you are:
1) Have you had any tickets in the last 3yrs.
2) Have you filed any claims in the last 3yrs. (right there your dead with most companies) The rate they'll quote you will be higher than normal until that claim becomes 3yrs. old and is no longer considered on your record
AND....if you change companies, your vanishing deductible starts all over again, which in itself is worth a couple hundred bucks saved each year.

There is a company maybe two that claim they offer "1st time forgiveness" but I don't know exactly how that works, what qualifies you for that or what companies offer it.

Hope this helps some.

ArtJoyce 07-25-2021 09:15 AM

This is my fourth RV that we used the stated value method. I have been thinking about increasing the stated value now since all RV values have increased.

Ljwt330 07-25-2021 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr.tommy (Post 5845441)
Well I'm not sure I understand your first paragraph or not but JIC I want to clarify something. Whether the coach has had good previous maintenance or not it doesn't matter to insurance companies as far as appraising the rig. They are going to base the value on how "they" value the coach with similar coaches of the year, engine type, your driving record, where your domicile is, have you had any accidents or claims in the past 3yrs., whether your FT or not etc, etc.

I currently have Nationwide. I just renewed my policy. Good rates and vanishing deductible with no claims. I asked about an agreed value. They said I would have to have an appraisal but that appraisal would be good for 3yrs. My previous underwriter—National General—said I needed a new appraisal too but every year if I wanted an Agreed Value OR in the event of a total loss, I would need to prove that my value is much higher than what they offer if I wasn't pleased with there value. Nationwide said the same thing. I chose to not get an appraisal because it's to expensive and too big of a hassle in my view being a FTer.

Appraisals usually run around $250-$400 or so depending on the coach. The cost of an appraisal will be based on all the systems it has, how intense it is and who's doing it. I'd expect your coach would be more than normal.

Nationwide told me they had a list of appraisers if I wanted a reference, but I would rather have an independent appraiser if I was going to do that. I chose not to get it appraised. But in my case I keep immaculate records of everything I do, receipts, pictures and videos as my evidence. That's the risk I took.

Also, I've learned and practice that ANY small fixes or accidents—as I define by anything under a $1,000-$1,500—I do myself and pay myself and DO NOT report them to the Insurance Co. for a claim. Except if it was a windshield replacement. The reason is, by the time you pay your deductible and the insurance company fixes the problem you really only saved a few hundred bucks. BUT here's the kicker, you DID file a claim and once you do that when your next premium comes back trust me it will be much higher.

I had a claim with National General 2.5yrs. ago and they took care of it el pronto. But my next premium upon renewal went up $1,400. That's when I moved to Nationwide and they DID NOT penalize me with a claim because the way they saw the claim it was a "no fault" claim. National General saw it as an "at fault claim" therefore the higher premium. So I naturally switched to Nationwide and have been with them now 2 going on 3yrs. and no premium increases for our motorhome or toad.

If you decide to shop for another company once a claim is ever filed, the first things the new company are going to ask you are:
1) Have you had any tickets in the last 3yrs.
2) Have you filed any claims in the last 3yrs. (right there your dead with most companies) The rate they'll quote you will be higher than normal until that claim becomes 3yrs. old and is no longer considered on your record
AND....if you change companies, your vanishing deductible starts all over again, which in itself is worth a couple hundred bucks saved each year.

There is a company maybe two that claim they offer "1st time forgiveness" but I don't know exactly how that works, what qualifies you for that or what companies offer it.

Hope this helps some.


I think the bold in the above post answers your question. If seeking agreed value, you will have to prove the value of the specific coach before the policy is written. Appraisals will probably be adequate, especially since Prevosts are all unique. Essentially, you may be facing the same "game" others face after a total loss where actual value is the standard, only it is "played" before the accident. Like some others, I have had agreed value policies on classic cars and never had to do more than submit photos, but that generally is a wider market in which the insurance companies have data for comparisons.

amosnandy 07-25-2021 10:16 AM

I am a licensed insurance adjuster in Minnesota. Reading this post I see a lot of misunderstanding.

1st. A lot of people go to buy insurance and are asked what the rig is worth. They say $50,000. Understand the agent will write you a $50,000 STATED value policy. That means that is the MAXIMUM a they will pay in the event of a total loss. Example: I just had an older camper with hail damage. They had a STATED value of $6000. Probably what they paid for it several years ago. Value came back at $7800. They did not understand why they only got $6000. Because that’s all the coverage they put on it. Stated value may also be called “DECLARED” value. It will only pay up too that value. After an incident we think might be a total loss, we run a market valuation. The insurance co will pay the lessor of market/appraised or the declared value.

There really is no such thing as an AGREED value. It is really an APPRAISED value. Some companies call it either, but make sure they will pay the AGREED orAPPRAISED value. They may agree to set a value just from purchase paperwork and repair/upgrade records, but to get an actual AGREED value they will probably require an inspection. Why? You asked? Insurance fraud. There are people who will sell an item at a greatly inflated value, write paperwork, and then it burns to the ground two months later.

On a Prevost, I would pay the money, get an appraisal and insure it for what it cost to replace. That may mean insuring it for more than you pay for it, or maybe even more than it is worth.

My son builds high end restoration, hot rods, and hand built customs. You may be able to go to Barret-Jackson and buy a 66 Impala SS convertible for $40,000 but if you had my son build you one, you might spend $100,000 to build it. That is what you want it insured for under a AGREED value.

If your Prevost is destroyed, how much would it cost you to not just buy another one but to make it EXATLY like the one you lost.

Make absolutely sure both you and the agent understand. And read your policy. I can’t believe when I ask simple questions to a customer “what does your policy say” they can’t answer. Nobody reads them, right? Well I assure you the insurance company will.

craigav 07-25-2021 10:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by amosnandy (Post 5845595)
I am a licensed insurance adjuster in Minnesota. Reading this post I see a lot of misunderstanding.

The insurance co will pay the lessor of market/appraised or the declared value.

I am a bit confused, what is the purpose of paying extra for a "declared value" insurance policy if the Ins. company is only going to pay out the lessor of the "market/appraised or the declared value"? (in particular if the declared value is higher than the market value) ~CA

amosnandy 07-25-2021 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mr.tommy (Post 5845441)

There is a company maybe two that claim they offer "1st time forgiveness" but I don't know exactly how that works, what qualifies you for that or what companies offer it.

Hope this helps some.

You pay for “Accident Forgiveness “ Allstate started it as a rider on any auto policy, but pretty much all companies do now.

Ljwt330 07-25-2021 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigav (Post 5845628)
I am a bit confused, what is the purpose of paying extra for a "declared value" insurance policy if the Ins. company is only going to pay out the lessor of the "market/appraised or the declared value"? (in particular if the declared value is higher than the market value) ~CA

"Declared Value" is not the same as "Stated" value. Declared value is what the insurance company begins with to caluclate the premium. Should an accident happen and the vehicle is totaled, the actual pay-out will be based on whatever the current market value is of that vehicle, regardless of the original declared value. This the most common type of policy and the one in which owners have to search the market to justify a higher pay out than the company is willing to pay.


Stated value is a fixed amount that will be paid if the vehicle is totaled. It is agreed to ahead of time. As mentioned, one may get less than the current market is charging for a like vehicle because it was already agreed that the fixed amount would be paid out. If you have a stated value policy, it is important to continually monitor the market and make adjustments on the stated amount over the years. This is mainly the concern of classic cars where they tend to be an appreciating asset.

craigav 07-25-2021 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ljwt330 (Post 5845670)
"Declared Value" is not the same as "Stated" value. Declared value is what the insurance company begins with to caluclate the premium. Should an accident happen and the vehicle is totaled, the actual pay-out will be based on whatever the current market value is of that vehicle, regardless of the original declared value. This the most common type of policy and the one in which owners have to search the market to justify a higher pay out than the company is willing to pay.


Stated value is a fixed amount that will be paid if the vehicle is totaled. It is agreed to ahead of time. As mentioned, one may get less than the current market is charging for a like vehicle because it was already agreed that the fixed amount would be paid out. If you have a stated value policy, it is important to continually monitor the market and make adjustments on the stated amount over the years. This is mainly the concern of classic cars where they tend to be an appreciating asset.


Thanks Larry, I will take some time and review my policy further. What happened to me is that I purchased mine for about 1/2 of the market value due to the death of a family friend and the family wanted to give me a great deal being a good friend of the family. When I went to insure it I was told that the payout (if totalled) would be the lower of the market value or what I paid (minus depreciation) for it unless I opted to purchase a declared value rider on the policy (or some similar words were used, they could have said "stated value", I don't remember) which I did opt for and insured very close to the market value instead of the purchase price. That was years back though, so I will review what the policy actually states so there will be no surprises. Thanks again, Craig

Ljwt330 07-25-2021 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigav (Post 5845696)
Thanks Larry, I will take some time and review my policy further. What happened to me is that I purchased mine for about 1/2 of the market value due to the death of a family friend and the family wanted to give me a great deal being a good friend of the family. When I went to insure it I was told that the payout (if totalled) would be the lower of the market value or what I paid (minus depreciation) for it unless I opted to purchase a declared value rider on the policy (or some similar words was used, they could have said "stated value", I don't remember) which I did opt for and insured very close to the market value instead of the purchase price. That was years back though, so I will review what the policy actually states so there will be no surprises. Thanks again, Craig

Glad I could help. I used to insure my classic cars, and it was always noted on various forums to continually update insurance coverage.


BTW, I should have edited my post to read that the payout on a declared value policy would be the market value or the declared value, if it was less.

mr.tommy 07-25-2021 11:56 AM

I didn't go into all the specifics in my original post# 4, since the OP was asking about something else. But since this thread is going into more about different values let me elaborate.

When I renewed my policy recently with Nationwide I adjusted my stated value. I told them I wanted a stated value of XXXXXXX. They agreed, the policy was written as such. BUT....they also said we will pay—up to—that maximum stated amount and no more in the case of a total loss. They went on to further say—for example—that in the event of a total loss the adjuster could deem that the RV was worth say 10K less than what was stated. Because the stated value is the MAX they will pay. So, in this example I'd have to prove that it was indeed worth my stated value of XXXXXXX and challenge the adjusters results and seek a higher value up to my stated value of XXXXXXX.

I know all of us struggle with insurance companies and how all these little details matter. It can get really confusing and that's by design IMO. For example as I said before with my "at fault" claim with National General, Nationwide reviewed the case—by reading the transcripts that were taken originally by National General when I filed a claim— and they said NO, we do not view this claim as a "at fault" accident and we will no hold you responsible and incur a higher premium. So two companies viewing this claim two different ways with the same information.

Now when you go insurance shopping there's no way you'll know how a company will view any claim until it happens. To much goes into judging claims. As in my above example. But another thing I have learned through that incident is, BEFORE you decide to call in for a claim, ask yourself, is this something you really want to do OR should do. And if you decide to file a claim make sure you're very careful about your wording in how the event took place. They listen and write down every word.

BCam 07-25-2021 12:09 PM

Progressive agreed to a higher value (I'm not sure of the exact term used in the policy) because I have a commercial quality, hydraulic wheelchair lift installed for which the PO had paid $15,000. There was no appraisal involved. Even though I got a good deal and didn't pay that much extra for the lift, if I was totaled, it would cost me that much and more to install one on another MH.


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