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-   -   KZ Connect Safety Recall (https://www.irv2.com/forums/f50/kz-connect-safety-recall-553678.html)

Cumminsfan 10-16-2021 10:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikemcbsr (Post 5950924)
I too own a 272FK and the instructions the dealer has requires them to bolt the new hangers to the HSS (hallow structural steel) of the trailer frame. As best as I could tell there is no requirement for a through sleeve added to the HSS or a mounting pad welded to the HSS. Nor does it instruct them to use a mag base drill. Also from what I could tell each hanger will only be attached with a single 3/8"-16 grade 5 bolt (I hope I am wrong about that). Don't hit any potholes at highway speed.
We too like our trailer and the floor plan and I am sympathetic to the dealer as this is not a common repair for them. KZ should have supplied a jig to locate and align the new hangers instead they ask the dealer to measure from the existing welded on hanger whoes width or hole location may or may not be the same as the other. To much to list what I don't like about this repair on this safety recall.
If you are an owner and have had it done to your 272FK how did it turn out?

Well I learned something new today. Who makes that frame?

frankjc1 10-17-2021 05:56 AM

I dropped mine off at the dealership last weekend and itís still sitting in the lot. I myself donít see how this ends well for me the owner or the dealer. To locate and drill 4 holes completely opposite from each other and be perfectly perpendicular from each other is unlikely which means the TT will never tow right. At best the tires will wear more quickly at worst the axles will pull off over time.
Last count there were 115 C272FK effected by the recall and there are more issues not as sever that need to be addressed

mikemcbsr 10-17-2021 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cumminsfan (Post 5951769)
Well I learned something new today. Who makes that frame?

Our TT is now at the dealer and I didn't take note of who the frame manufacturer was. I am a retired tradesman with over 40 years of fabricating, welding, machining, machine building and installation and this modification may be beyond the skill set of some RV techs. Simply, the units should be replaced by KZ after all they admit to an "engineering error" as the cause. We were also offered a trade in deal that would cost us a further 15K to move into the same 2022 model. KZ should pay that difference and the recalled units should be sent to a fab shop to have the new hangers properly installed and welded in place before being put back on the market.

Tomahawk 10-18-2021 12:19 AM

Glad it is not my trailer...
To be honest, I don't think moving the axle should be that difficult. I would have lots of concerns about how it is done. I reread this and it sound contradictory. I meant that it shouldn't be difficult if performed by a skill technician with adequate instructions and direction. To do the repair, I would have a gauge made so I could move each hanger exactly the same amount. I doubt it matters if the hanger is moved 7.4 or 7.6 as long as they are all moved the same amount. There is also no way I'd accept a bolt through a hollow frame, it would have to be welded. I completely agree with whoever said this seems beyond the capability of the guy at the local RV shop. I would try to get KZ to allow me to take it a trailer fabricator or repair shop and have them perform the repair. I bet the trailer repair shop (like tractor trailers) is cheaper than the RV dealer for KZ and even if they were not, I'd pay the difference for piece of mind. Just my two cent.
As a side note, you could figure out much they are trying to correct the tongue weight if you measured the current tongue weight, measured the trailer weight, and measured the distance from the center of the axles to the ball. For example, if the trailer weighs 7000lb and the TW is 500lb and the ball to axle center is 200 inches, the trailer CG is 500*200/7000 = 14.3 inches in front of the center of the axles. Moving the axles back 7.5 inches would make the new TW = (14.3+7.5)*7000/(200+7.5) = 735lb none of those numbers are real, just things I made up. Just checking the TW and comparing it to 13% of the GVWR should give you a good idea of how much they should be correcting TW.

Cumminsfan 10-18-2021 11:06 AM

According to the KZ website regarding construction features it shows an NXG frame which according to the pic is a huck bolted frame thats not hollow.
Some pics of the suspension would be nice.
https://www.kz-rv.com/products/conne...struction.html

mikemcbsr 10-19-2021 01:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cumminsfan (Post 5954158)
According to the KZ website regarding construction features it shows an NXG frame which according to the pic is a huck bolted frame thats not hollow.
Some pics of the suspension would be nice.
https://www.kz-rv.com/products/conne...struction.html

Itís quite conceivable the frame is formed channel and not HSS. When I peaked under it looked like HSS but formed channel would make sense for weight reduction. NXG specs say all components are CNC positioned and robotically welded and slides are huck fastened. This recall ďfixĒ is a sub par compromise so a dealer can possibly do it. Iím betting most dealers would rather farm it out. As I have said from what I understand each hanger will be fastened with one 3/8 bolt. This will have the effect of hanging the suspension on hinge pins. I think the hope is that having the hanger tight to the underside of the frame will limit or prevent movement. Not likely, the hangers will be peening the frames from day one. I hope I am wrong but this is what I was led to believe. Ours is at the dealer and awaiting the parts. Weíll see what the outcome is soon I hope.

Cumminsfan 10-19-2021 06:10 PM

Best of luck to you. It'll be interesting to see how this develops.

Tomahawk 10-19-2021 09:20 PM

I looked at the frame link, it looks like a C-Channel or an I Beam. I knew my frame was an I Beam so I went out and looked at how my Hangers are attached. Made me sad. The load path is crap. Apparently, it is good enough but I would never dream of attaching it the way it was done. It is welded in place but relies on the contact and bending of the hanger center plate and I beam cap. Not a gusset or shear web to be found.
I'd need to see details of the new attachment but I think a good starting point would be what you said earlier, the repair hanger should be attached exactly the same way the original hanger was attached IMHO.

mikemcbsr 10-20-2021 12:37 PM

I received clarification from KZ about the relocation of the axles and the mounting of the new hangers specifically. EACH Hanger will have 4 bolts for fastening, not four bolts for the entire suspension. Some dealers have tackled this job themselves and others have sent the unit out to a trailer/truck shop to get done. Our dealer is waiting for the parts to determine which way they want to go. This job will require that the new hangers are set back 7 1/2" and the axles are 29 1/2" centre to centre. There is a replacement skirting kit and one of the previous holes for the original skirting gets covered up by a yellow reflective marker.
I hope this helps any other owners of this model who have the recall.

JillandBud 10-22-2021 02:32 PM

Bolt or weld? And a couple more questions.
 
We too, have a KZ 272FK on recall. We live in Florida and found out about the recall in Montana in the middle of a 72 day camping trip. We had fiddled with our weight distribution hitch, added a sway bar and new tires to our truck and moved weight to the front of the trailer and the back of the truck. Bud was still exhausted after each day of driving. We had planned mostly back roads and ended up avoiding interstates entirely from Montana all the way home. KZ sent the parts package to a welding and fabrication outfit near us (I found them and gave KZ the contact). We expect a fix date soon. We have questions:

1. Bolt or weld? According to KZ, the frame was supposed to be bolted, but Norco needed to speed up production so our axle hangers are welded. If the fabricator welds the new ones, KZ won’t warrant the welds. Should we insist they bolt it?

2. We are contemplating buying a ProPride 3P hitch as we are going full time once the fix is done. Would that be enough to overcome any lingering problems with the towing? Would it be worth it? Would we then be able to use our hitch rack on the trailer, which we bought but couldn’t use the way it tows now?

3. We have uneven wear on our tires. One KZ rep said that would happen if the load was off (as it was before the fix) but our warranty rep says we have to take the trailer to a dealer and they will determine what, if anything, comes under warranty. Considering our pain and suffering with this thing so far we think they should just give us new tires. I would have preferred new axles, suspension, wheels and tires, but that won’t happen.

4. If this were you would you just say KZ sucks and get another trailer from a manufacturer not part of the Thor conglomerate?

Tomahawk 10-22-2021 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JillandBud (Post 5959312)
...

1. Bolt or weld? According to KZ, the frame was supposed to be bolted, but Norco needed to speed up production so our axle hangers are welded. If the fabricator welds the new ones, KZ wonít warrant the welds. Should we insist they bolt it?

2. We are contemplating buying a ProPride 3P hitch as we are going full time once the fix is done. Would that be enough to overcome any lingering problems with the towing? Would it be worth it? Would we then be able to use our hitch rack on the trailer, which we bought but couldnít use the way it tows now?

3. We have uneven wear on our tires. One KZ rep said that would happen if the load was off (as it was before the fix) but our warranty rep says we have to take the trailer to a dealer and they will determine what, if anything, comes under warranty. Considering our pain and suffering with this thing so far we think they should just give us new tires. I would have preferred new axles, suspension, wheels and tires, but that wonít happen.

4. If this were you would you just say KZ sucks and get another trailer from a manufacturer not part of the Thor conglomerate?

1. I would either weld and bolt or just bolt. KZ is saying to bolt it so I would do that without question. I can think of how the weld would hurt so I'd treat that as optional.
2. I would get repair done and then tow it before spending money on a new hitch.
3. I think even you could convince them to give you new tires, they would give you crappy tires. Maybe you could convince them to give you a credit with the RV dealer. I don't think this would be worth the time I had to invest in it to get it done. I might take it to the dealer, get them to write something up, and then send that to KZ and say "you owe me tires, they wore out because of your error". My guess you be they offer you a small credit, like $50. The difference in price between the goodyear endurances I got Sams Club and the local RV shops was way more than that.
4. I would wait until after the fix to make any judgement. The fact that they are making repairs and not just telling you to front load the trailer is something. I could be wrong and the repair is being forced by DOT, I don't know.
I am not surprised this mistake as made. It is probably a simple math error, like someone entered 100lb instead of 10lb for something. Engineers make errors all the time. What surprises me about this is the did not check the first one built with a scale. I would have made the first one, measured the Trailer weight and Tongue Weight, and thought "that ain't right, I must have made an error somewhere". It couldn't take more than an hour to take the measurements.

mikemcbsr 10-23-2021 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tomahawk (Post 5959353)
1. I would either weld and bolt or just bolt. KZ is saying to bolt it so I would do that without question. I can think of how the weld would hurt so I'd treat that as optional.
2. I would get repair done and then tow it before spending money on a new hitch.
3. I think even you could convince them to give you new tires, they would give you crappy tires. Maybe you could convince them to give you a credit with the RV dealer. I don't think this would be worth the time I had to invest in it to get it done. I might take it to the dealer, get them to write something up, and then send that to KZ and say "you owe me tires, they wore out because of your error". My guess you be they offer you a small credit, like $50. The difference in price between the goodyear endurances I got Sams Club and the local RV shops was way more than that.
4. I would wait until after the fix to make any judgement. The fact that they are making repairs and not just telling you to front load the trailer is something. I could be wrong and the repair is being forced by DOT, I don't know.
I am not surprised this mistake as made. It is probably a simple math error, like someone entered 100lb instead of 10lb for something. Engineers make errors all the time. What surprises me about this is the did not check the first one built with a scale. I would have made the first one, measured the Trailer weight and Tongue Weight, and thought "that ain't right, I must have made an error somewhere". It couldn't take more than an hour to take the measurements.

I agree with this advice. The "repair" was approved by the NHTSA and has to be done. I would stick to the engineered design that requires the new hangers to be bolted on. As for your tires I would suspect you have some axle misalignment either to themselves or to the centreline of the trailer or a combination and if that is the case then it is important to have the axles checked for alignment BEFORE proceeding with the axle relocation as the new hangers are positioned relative to the existing hangers. If the original hangers are off so will your new ones since the instructions are to measure from the originals to position the new hangers.
I can't see how your tires would not be a warranty item if the axles are off.
Although, it could be possible that all the sway on your long trip did cause excess wear but it's worth checking the axles before they proceed.

I am in Canada and was to pull our unit to Florida for the winter but I cancelled that until I am confident it is safe to pull. I tried all the same tricks as Bud but nothing worked. Another issue I hope they factored in is that there is no pass through at the front of this model so the rear gets loaded down with gear. We added an aluminum checker plate box to store what we normally stored at the front in our previous travel trailers. I removed it to see if that was the cause before I knew of the recall but it made no difference. I am going to test it with the box on and filled with the usual gear when we get our unit back. I may add a couple of bicycles to the back too. Good luck.

frankjc1 10-23-2021 11:31 AM

KZ told me this is a warranty issue, I know I know it's a Safety Recall. The Recall notice says it was an engineering error. I understand, a "warranty issue is not the same as a "recall," by calling it a warranty problem will KZ continue to be responsible for all of the issues that are the result of the recall once the warranty expires? I don't know. Will my insurance cover me if something should happen as a result of the recall?



For me, once the work is done, or sooner, I'm trading the thing in and let the dealership worry about it. I tried to trade it in at a different dealership but they haven't got back to me and it's been nearly 10 days. My guess is the word is out! We too bought this unit looking forward to extended travel but to be always worried about the 3/8" axle bolts going at highway speed will be to stressful. I'm I going to have to crawl under the camper and check the frame and torque of the bolts every time I stop for gas? Will the tires wear out or blow out due to misalignment? My guess is this is going to be costly, not to Thor/KZ but to the customer you and me.

Tomahawk 10-23-2021 12:28 PM

I apologize to anyone who read my message above. I made at least five typing errors. They make it hard to read. It made me sad to re-read it.


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