How to find brochure and specs for 2001/02 Ambassador 30 and 32 PBD?

[protege91]

Holiday Rambler experts: In my search for a small DP, I've run across two HR Ambassador models that I cannot find brochures or specs for. One is a 2001 30PBD and the other is a 2002 32PBD. When I google for the 2001/02 Ambassador brochures, the smallest one listed is the 34'. I'd like to learn more about these as they seem like quality units.

Can anyone provide me any hints as to why I'm seeing models for sale that don't exist in the brochures? Thanks in advance!

Jake
Currently in 07 Navion, looking to upgrade to a DP <32'

PS. My apologies if this posts to the wrong forum. I'm trying to post to the HR owners' group, but the new thread made me pick a forum and I didn't see the HR group listed. I'm an IT guy but I'm not used to this forum system! :(

[l1v3fr33ord1]

protege91-

A different model than the Ambassador, perhaps? Monaco lists a 30PBD and 32PBD in the 2002 Knight (link here) and 2003 Cayman (link here) brochures.

Monaco brochures are here. I can't get to the HR brochure site (link here) to search for similar models.

[8.3Oilbuner]

Good morning Protege91; I was shopping new back in 2001 for a Knight and an Ambassador. The models you are interested in are cousins to one another. Floor plans and specs. are almost the same except for some exterior & exterior colors. I looked a quiet a few of them. You should be able to use the Knight specs. for the Holiday Rambler. I waited a couple of years and found a used Monaco Windsor for what the dealers wanted me to pay new for the Knight and Ambassador. Glad I waited. No comparison whatsoever. The Windsor has way more features, better chassis, bigger engine and transmission, side radiator and on and on. Sorry off subject. Use the Knight specs. and should be the same for the Ambassador!

[protege91]

Mark, nope, they are indeed Ambassadors! Or at least labeled and stickered as such!

This is the 32' Ambassador. (link) I've seen the unit but dealer still prepping before I can test drive. The dealer hates me (and all cash buyers, it seems) anyway, and they're not really smart (notice they list the fuel type as CNG).

This is the 30' Ambassador (link) I think I'm interested but I'm not anywhere near Florida to check it out yet.

I wanted the brochures to see the specs so I can compare and contrast during the homework phase before wasting people's times with a showing. I'll check out the Monaco versions but it's still baffling that there these short models are missing from the HR brochures so I had to ask.

I got to the HR brochure site previously. Fun fact, for 2002 the only item in the model dropdown is the Navigator. But I found the 2001 brochure there... it just doesn't list the 30/32' models.

I'm mildly familiar with the Knight and Cayman (although I'm not sure which one ranks above the other). I was pursuing Cayman 30PBD but someone beat me to it.

[protege91]

Thanks 8.3! Not familiar with Windsor but I'll check it out if one comes up. I research models based on what comes up for sale given my search criteria. Mainly small DP's or FREDs of good quality (Allegro Breeze, Journey/Horizon, Knight/Cayman, anything that's not a Thor or Forest River). Still learning the options. Upsizing from a Navion. Thanks for your help!

[Kenrbass]

Interesting, my 02 admiral gas is the same pbd model number. On the admiral, a 32 ft is set up for washing machine and 30 is not. I have heard short pushers drive strange with a lot of weight and not a lot of length to offset it, but have not driven one myself. It was a battle trying to find a decent one and not have someone beat us to it.
Good luck

[l1v3fr33ord1]

Originally Posted by protege91

Mark, nope, they are indeed Ambassadors! Or at least labeled and stickered as such!

I worded things poorly in my earlier post. I should have said that Monaco and Holiday Rambler usually made similar models in their lineups. For instance, my coach is the same in its model year as the Monaco Monarch (and the Safari Simba gas, as Monaco owned the Safari brand by 2008). In general, differences were in appearance items, such as color schemes, designs, and paint.

If you examine the 2002 HR Ambassador 32PBD photos you will find it the same floorplan as the 2002 Knight 32PBD shown in the Monaco brochure. I would assume that the brochure for the Monaco represents the 2002 Ambassador except for appearance items.

It appears as if the 2002 Knight 30PBD floorplan matches the photos for the 2001 Ambassador 30PBD. I would assume that the Monaco brochure represents the 2001 Ambassador except for appearance items and perhaps some features and options. It is possible there are more substantial differences, such as chassis, between model years 2001 and 2002.

In sum, you should be able to use the 2002 Knight brochure as a guide for both coaches. Of course, "8.3Oilbuner" already said as much!

One thing I noticed in the coaches, and confirmed by the 2002 brochure, is the "plank" floor in the kitchen and bath areas. This is a step up from the vinyl found in less-expensive coaches.

A couple of years ago I searched for short diesel coaches (generally, 34 feet or less). They are rare after 2008. All the best in your search.

[JJTL]

Hi Jake,

The 2003 brochure for the Holiday Rambler Ambassador, shows the 30PBD and 32PBD floor plans. See link below. Might have been a late 2002 addition, hence why it didn't make it into the 2002 brochure.

2003 Holiday Rambler Ambassador Brochure: https://library.rvusa.com/brochure/H...ambassador.pdf

All the best with your search!
Josh

P.S. As others have suggested Monaco made some short floor plans in their higher end models. This includes the Monaco Dynasty and Monaco Windsor. These 2 models were built on the highest end S-Series Roadmaster chassis in the early 2000s. The Ambassador is a great coach, but no comparison to how the Dynasty & Windsor would have been built and how they drive down the road. 8 airbags instead of 4 airbags. The Ambassador likely has the small 5.9L Cummins ISB vs the 8.3L Cummins ISC in the Dynasty and Windsor. Have a search, you might be able to find one that is close to your price range. The Dynasty had a 34' floor plan all the way to 2002. The Windsor had a 32' floor plan into at least 2000 or so. Some examples below:

2000 Monaco Dynasty Brochure: https://library.rvusa.com/brochure/00Dynasty.pdf

2000 Monaco Windsor Brochure: https://library.rvusa.com/brochure/00Windsor.pdf

Here are the model lineups, in case it's helpful:



The Holiday Rambler Ambassador was equal to the Monaco Knight, if you are trying to equate the two hierarchies.

[8.3Oilbuner]

Good afternoon Protege91; The dealership that 32' Ambassador is at has always been a well know dealer, but I think things and have changed over the years. My opinion! Short diesel pushers have always been in short supply as not a lot were built. Demand for these shorter units has increased in the last couple of years meaning higher asking prices. I mentioned that I bought a Windsor model and it was a 32' non slide model, year, 2000. Very rare!!! Since I purchased in in December of 03 I have only seen 2 for sale! I now have a 34' Monaco Windsor with the kitchen slide only. I had the 32' Windsor sold 2 years before I decided to sell the unit.

There are a couple of things to take into consideration on the Ambassador before you buy. Never can remember the years, but on that chassis make sure it is not the one that has the rear trailing arm issue or has had the upgraded trailing arm installed. I hope someone here will chime in on that issue! Also, my experience along with others. Short diesel pushers are not the greatest handling coaches. Some describe the handling as the tail wagging the dog! I got used to the handling of the 32' Windsor, but my wife would not drive it. Very susceptible to cross winds and semi's passing you and give you the PUSH while passing. This is just me, but I can't believe the handling difference between the 32' Windsor and the 34' Windsor. The 34' only has a 17" longer wheelbase than the 32'.

Just some FYI to pass along. Good luck on your search!

[vito.a]

Don't fall into the trap of searching for only a short length diesel coach. You will pay more and most are terrible handling.
This advice is from someone that made that precise mistake.
I'd also recommend you search for a coach as high up in the lineup as will fit your budget.
Wish you all the best!

[protege91]

Wow! Just found a brochure (2001) for the Admiral and saw that. I had always assumed that the PBD's were all DPs (in my head I translated it as "Pushed By Diesel). Shows how I shouldn't assume anything...

I too have read more and more stories of short DPs "porpoising" on the road. Reportedly FREDs don't have that problem. There's a Tiffin Allegro 32' FRED online that I might go check out. I'm not married to the idea of a RED.

Originally Posted by Kenrbass

Interesting, my 02 admiral gas is the same pbd model number. On the admiral...

[JJTL]

The best thing to do is drive both options, the front diesels you can find and some diesel pushers.

For us personally, more than anything, it’s the ride of air suspension that was important to us. I don’t believe any of the front engine diesels are on air ride chassis. FREDs are similar to the gasoline chassis with the diesel instead. The front engine diesel and gas chassis tend not to suffer from porpoising, however in general they ride much harsher than the air ride of most diesel pushers.

This all comes down to personal preference and how you intend to use the coach. Air ride certainly has more maintenance, but floating on a cloud (in comparison to the harsh spring chassis) is well worth it to us.

Just some thoughts.
Josh

[protege91]

Thank you all for your comments. Very helpful!

JJTL--thanks for the model lineups. YES, I have been trying to make a list of "this Monaco = that HR", and this helped.

8.3--I believe it's the R4R chassis models with the fragile rear trailing arms. When I looked under the 02 Ambassador in question, it was a totally different setup! I assumed it was the model year--I ready somewhere that in a specific year (maybe 2003?) the bad trailing arms started being used because Monaco decided to make their own in-house. If I find the right unit with the bad trailing arms, and if the price is right, I'll consider installing the Source Engineering replacements.

And I was just coming to the same conclusion you shared--maybe I shouldn't prioritize a DP. Especially since (now that I realize it) my full-time RV lifestyle has changed from traveling everywhere every day (my first year) to staying put in one area for a few months at a time--only making a couple cross country trips a year. With all the money I save buying a gasser, I sure can finance a lot of stops at the gas pump!

My bigger concern was mechanical reliability and fuel economy--I'm afraid of the Ford V10, and I drive enough to enjoy diesel fuel economy and torque (66% of my miles are in Sierra Nevada, Rocky, and Appalachian mountains). The extra initial cost doesn't scare me because I typically buy quality stuff that doesn't depreciate as fast and take care of it. Also I like driving, and I want to drive something I enjoy driving. Driving oversized Ford vans is boring and makes me sleepy. Driving bad-handling scary things is more fun (my daily driver/toad is an '87 Samurai, and even though I risk death when I drive it on I-80 over Donner Pass, you can bet that I am awake, alert, and grinning all the way!

vito.a--Regardless of everything I just said, I'm starting to open my mind up to considering your advice! Thank you!!

*Sorry that was long. I'm having a boring day and felt like typing a lot. Thanks for listening and thank you all for your advice!*

[protege91]

Josh, You're right, I need to drive both. I haven't yet. I can't get a dealer to call me back for anything, even when I say I'm a cash buyer with an easy-to-sell trade (if they want it, otherwise I can sell privately and enjoy more money in my pocket). Fine, I'll wait until the current RV fad is over and buy one cheaper then; their loss!

Thank you for reminding me of the air-ride advantages. That could be important on the soul-crushing stretches of I-10 and I-20 in TX, LA, MS that almost shattered my Navion to pieces in May.